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Subject Topic: Towing Weights and Measures Post Reply Post New Topic
18/6/2013 at 1:30pm
 Location: Manchester
 Outfit: Swift Challenger 524
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Hi all,
Whilst i am reasonably new to towing and did quite a lot of research before buying our van, I am increasingly worried over the amount of people purchasing a van and then asking will my car tow it.

Know i am not trying to educate people or create an argument by posting about this, but to re-iterate to some people whom are considering buying a caravan a few points first.

1> confirm the kerbweight of your car, easy done by visiting your local weight bridge, normally a couple of £'s. Dont rely on manufactures data it is sometimes incorrect and misleading.

once you know this as a basic guideline a caravan should be approx 85% of the vehicle kerbweight.

Now some cars have higher towing capacity than the kerbweight i.e 4x4's, whilst some also have towing weights much less than the kerbweight. These details will be on your V5 reg doc.

Basic simple rule DO NOT TOW if the towed vehicle (caravan/trailer/fc etc is greater in weight than the car.

Also to be observed is the Max gross weight of the car and van/trailer as a unit must not be more than 3500Kgs, again depending on your license with B + E on it pre 1997 , post 1997(test driving test passed) will need to take a test to be able to tow this weight.

2. Loading a van is also very critical to the stability of your unit. i.e. MIRO of van = 1050 Kgs and MTPLM = 1300 Kgs resulting in a 250 kgs payload. Great i here you say can load, loads of stuff, STOP, remember these first

Motor Mover = 36 Kgs
Battery = 28Kgs
Gas Bottles = x2 10 - 15 Kgs

New vans have battery and gas bottles included in the MIRO.

These have to be subtracted form your MTPLM so 1300 - 74 = 176 kgs, which on the scale of things is not very much. LOAD carefully and observe other posts on here with basic weights for items.

3. Nose weight, the force that is imposed on the tow ball, now this can vary for each van, but ensure the towbar can carry the weight and then load the van so you have the correct nose weight. To heavy and the front wheels of the car are lifted and the rear suspension over compressed and too light the van lifts the back of the car, hence no traction of the rear wheels.

In reality we have a van with a MTPLM of 1300 Kgs and have struggled to find an adequate car (finances accepted) keeping within all the guidelines etc with which we can safely tow ie. our first car Ford Focus Estate Zetec II 2006 2.0 tdci Kebweight 1429 Kgs (measured on weight bridge) therefore 85% = 1214 Kgs, so could not travel at full weight with van although towing limit is much higher. 1300 Kgs would have been 91%, not ideal for new towers.

Second car was Volvo v70 estate 2009 again kerbweight 1610 Kgs with 85 % being 1368Kgs, so could tow at full weight which equated to 80.75%.

Currently tow with a Vx antara, and we are down to about 74% .

And i must say that i considered the Focus to two better than the Volvo.

Like i said earlier please be aware of the weights and loading and what car is going to be used to tow your van, as i don't want to come across your accident (possibly), or you be in an accident with me because of poor loading and weights.

Just take a little more care about it and if your car is not suitable then find a van which makes it suitable or change the car.

We had too .

enjoy the summer season and load responsibly.

Chris W




18/6/2013 at 6:42pm
 Location: Midlands
 Outfit: Mondeo Avondale Gram
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Few changes needed..

"once you know this as a basic guideline a caravan should be approx 85% of the vehicle kerbweight."

It is only a recommended figure. Not a should be figure.


Noseweight totally wrong. If its too light does it really lift the back of the car and the rear wheels off the ground?   NO
Too heavy and you exceed the towbars limits and could overload the rear axle.
It would have tobe seriously overloaded to lift the front wheels.




18/6/2013 at 11:13pm
 Location: None Entered
 Outfit: lunar venus
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Above,

Post 1997 licence holder?

Max tow weight = Cars gross laden weight + Caravans gross laden weight.

These 2 figures must not exceed 3500kg. And the Caravans gross laden weight must not exceed the cars UNLADEN weight.

Unless the manufacturer has set a lower limit.

Isn't it,
Max tow weight = Cars gross laden weight + Caravans mas weight.

So the actual weight or the towing vehicle and the total allowed weight of the towed vehicle.

So if a trailer is empty of full its the full weight you go by even if its empty. But the car is the weight it is at that time not what it could be.

Do I make any sence.



18/6/2013 at 11:18pm
 Location: None Entered
 Outfit: lunar venus
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Quote: Originally posted by TrigGLX on 18/6/2013
Hi all,
Whilst i am reasonably new to towing and did quite a lot of research before buying our van, I am increasingly worried over the amount of people purchasing a van and then asking will my car tow it.

Know i am not trying to educate people or create an argument by posting about this, but to re-iterate to some people whom are considering buying a caravan a few points first.

1> confirm the kerbweight of your car, easy done by visiting your local weight bridge, normally a couple of £'s. Dont rely on manufactures data it is sometimes incorrect and misleading.

once you know this as a basic guideline a caravan should be approx 85% of the vehicle kerbweight.

Now some cars have higher towing capacity than the kerbweight i.e 4x4's, whilst some also have towing weights much less than the kerbweight. These details will be on your V5 reg doc.

Basic simple rule DO NOT TOW if the towed vehicle (caravan/trailer/fc etc is greater in weight than the car.

Also to be observed is the Max gross weight of the car and van/trailer as a unit must not be more than 3500Kgs, again depending on your license with B + E on it pre 1997 , post 1997(test driving test passed) will need to take a test to be able to tow this weight.

2. Loading a van is also very critical to the stability of your unit. i.e. MIRO of van = 1050 Kgs and MTPLM = 1300 Kgs resulting in a 250 kgs payload. Great i here you say can load, loads of stuff, STOP, remember these first

Motor Mover = 36 Kgs
Battery = 28Kgs
Gas Bottles = x2 10 - 15 Kgs

New vans have battery and gas bottles included in the MIRO.

These have to be subtracted form your MTPLM so 1300 - 74 = 176 kgs, which on the scale of things is not very much. LOAD carefully and observe other posts on here with basic weights for items.

3. Nose weight, the force that is imposed on the tow ball, now this can vary for each van, but ensure the towbar can carry the weight and then load the van so you have the correct nose weight. To heavy and the front wheels of the car are lifted and the rear suspension over compressed and too light the van lifts the back of the car, hence no traction of the rear wheels.

In reality we have a van with a MTPLM of 1300 Kgs and have struggled to find an adequate car (finances accepted) keeping within all the guidelines etc with which we can safely tow ie. our first car Ford Focus Estate Zetec II 2006 2.0 tdci Kebweight 1429 Kgs (measured on weight bridge) therefore 85% = 1214 Kgs, so could not travel at full weight with van although towing limit is much higher. 1300 Kgs would have been 91%, not ideal for new towers.

Second car was Volvo v70 estate 2009 again kerbweight 1610 Kgs with 85 % being 1368Kgs, so could tow at full weight which equated to 80.75%.

Currently tow with a Vx antara, and we are down to about 74% .

And i must say that i considered the Focus to two better than the Volvo.

Like i said earlier please be aware of the weights and loading and what car is going to be used to tow your van, as i don't want to come across your accident (possibly), or you be in an accident with me because of poor loading and weights.

Just take a little more care about it and if your car is not suitable then find a van which makes it suitable or change the car.

We had too .

enjoy the summer season and load responsibly.

Chris W






Also post 1997 licence holders (no B+E ) cannot tow anything with a mass weight of over 750 kgs, unless the mass weight of the towed vehicle is less than the unlaiden weight of the towing vehicle and does not exceed 3500kgs.
So any trailer over 750kgs ( anything with brakes ) you need B+E.


19/6/2013 at 7:20am
 Location: 
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To understand why those who have no clue remain clueless, one only has to read the 3 posts above.

-------------
Regards, Jack+Jon.


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19/6/2013 at 10:59am
 Location: renfrew
 Outfit: kia seddona coachman pastiche 2010
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    i found the c.c  car + caravan matching site ok it gave all info needed when you put your car and your carvan makes +years in try it before you buy any van

  



19/6/2013 at 11:17am
 Location: Devon
 Outfit: Cabanon Malawi 2.0
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Originally posted by lunarvenus on 18/6/2013
Quote: So any trailer over 750kgs ( anything with brakes ) you need B+E.


No, that is not correct. Refer to the information in Grampian91's signature above for the correct rules.

Towing over 750kg on a B licence is fine as long as the car's gross weight plus the caravan's MTPLM do not exceed 3500kg, and the caravan is not heavier than the car's unladen weight (and its max towing limit).

For example, my car has a gross weight of 2010kg. Therefore (ignoring other factors), I can legally tow 1490kg on my B licence (that's 3500kg-2010kg). However, this exceeds my car's unladen weight of 1410kg (from memory), so I am then legally limited to towing 1410kg. However (!) my car's max towing limit is 1400kg, so in fact I am limited to 1400kg by the car manufacturer.

Post last edited on 19/06/2013 11:24:32


19/6/2013 at 2:34pm
 Location: Harrogate Yorkshire.
 Outfit: Skoda Octavia 4x4 & Compass Omega 482
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Use the Mass in Service which can be found in the car V5C document.
Noseweight recommended 5% - 7% of the caravan MTPLM, then when on the towball it becomes part of the cars payload, another factor when loading the car and axle limits.

The following info sheets are also useful:
https://www.dropbox.com/s/dlkxxx3v6vvnyve/Matching-car-van.pdf

https://www.dropbox.com/s/1zy48ttzqabrzqz/noseweights%202013.pdf

-------------
Skoda Octavia Estate 2.0TDi 4x4 (2012) towing a Compass Omega 482 (2014)


19/6/2013 at 4:43pm
 Location: None Entered
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The answer is so simple as to whether you car and van are a good match just use this easy formula

g(x) = (1 + x)α(1 − x)−1−α,exp − 1+2λ(x+t) f(t)dt.



-------------
Mike


19/6/2013 at 7:48pm
 Location: Midlands
 Outfit: Mondeo Avondale Gram
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Quote: Originally posted by Jack+Jon on 19/6/2013
To understand why those who have no clue remain clueless, one only has to read the 3 posts above.




Please explain. Are you saying towing weights are a mystery ?   



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19/6/2013 at 8:14pm
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Quote: Originally posted by Grampian91 on 19/6/2013
Please explain. Are you saying towing weights are a mystery ?   


I was merely pointing out that those who do find towing weights mystifiying are unlikely to gain much from reading this thread...

-------------
Regards, Jack+Jon.


19/6/2013 at 9:06pm
 Location: Harrogate Yorkshire.
 Outfit: Skoda Octavia 4x4 & Compass Omega 482
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Quote: Originally posted by Hymer530 on 19/6/2013
The answer is so simple as to whether you car and van are a good match just use this easy formula

g(x) = (1 + x)α(1 − x)−1−α,exp − 1+2λ(x+t) f(t)dt.




Easy 82.3%
To make it even easier, download the Excel spreadsheet on to your hard drive and just put in the kerbweight / mass in service of the car and the caravans MTPLM.

https://www.dropbox.com/s/e6vsubadpj9dnmy/caravanweightchart-4.xlsx

-------------
Skoda Octavia Estate 2.0TDi 4x4 (2012) towing a Compass Omega 482 (2014)



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