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 Topic: 1 shot or 2 Pack resin delamination kit?
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30/9/2019 at 5:12pm
Location: Lichfield
Outfit: Coachman Amara 450
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I had to undertake a floor delamination repair to my previous caravan and had the same dilemma to you whether to use the one shot bonding agent or the 2 part epoxy resin pack. I eventually spoke to a person who worked for a caravan service company who did all kinds of servicing and repairs and they said that the company only ever used the one shot adhesive and never had any rejects from customers. The floor has to be supported (not jacked up) underneath and a heavy weight on the top such as a slab or bricks etc. I used the leisure battery but make sure you put a sheet of polythene down over the repaired area first to avoid the excess adhesive sticking. However, the secret is to leave the one shot adhesive for 48 hours so it cures respectively and bonds to a 100% guaranteed fix. Quite often the repair is only left over night which is enough to harden but not cure. It's very much like gloss paint where it's touch dry in a few hours but the whole curing process actually takes around 5 to 7 days for the paint to become hard.
I used the one shot adhesive following the above advice without any issues and after 3 years when I part exchanged the caravan the floor was still solid.
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30/9/2019 at 5:52pm
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Thanks for the reply smartgolfer and tango55.
In response to your post smartgolfer, I should have mentioned that I checked the integrity of the floor and wall edge battens, along with the moisture content of the floor inside and out and there is no sign of damp (8-10 %). I fully agree that any "rot" would have meant a major overhaul job!
The floor is made up of two thin sheets of ply (approx 4-5mm) and a 30mm core of black "polystyrene". The van is an Elddis GTX Typhoon 2000.
Basically over half of the screws holding the wall to the floor had snapped on the n/s of the van, probably caused by the previous owner hitting a pothole or something similar.
This allowed the wall to "bounce" the floor up and down on the remaining screws which in turn I suspect caused the loss of strength in the floor. I've put in double the original amount of stainless screws on that side, but the floor is still unable to hold the weight.
Tango55, thank you for your experience, its good to hear your tips and how you got on. Due to the age of my caravan, I have lino which appears to be stuck down to the top layer of ply. I'm guessing trying to get it up is going to be a nightmare, so I've got a couple of options;
1. Punch out pieces of lino to drill the holes, putting the cuts back in again and then getting a carpet fitter to lay some new lino over the top,
2. Cut the lino out in the walkway and get a new piece relaid, putting a joining strip to the bathroom doorway,
3. Strip out all the furniture and rip out all the lino.....
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30/9/2019 at 8:19pm
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i drilled holes did the one shot and put more lino over the top..
use plenty of dowels.. drilling the holes and tapping in the dowels is the easy bit.. i used loads.. the dowels provide the strength..
trog
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01/10/2019 at 9:45am
Location: Near Alton Towers
Outfit: Bailey Burgundy S7 H
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Similar to trog and tango, i've used the one-shot stuff successfully in 3 separate areas in my van over the last six years. I found it less prone to over foaming and therefore didn't need to use support under, and weights over the job whilst curing. Yes, use plenty dowels, (I used 10mm ones). they are cheap as chips and when the resin sets onto them provide the strenth in the floor not just the foam which has filled the void. Wet them before inserting them as the water activates the resin. It's a messy job so try and tidy up the worst as you go, but not rocket science and will save you a few quid.
Dave.
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Give a man a fish and he will eat for a day,
Teach a man to fish and you can get rid of him for a whole weekend.
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18/7/2021 at 3:53pm
Location: Near Alton Towers
Outfit: Bailey Burgundy S7 H
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Mine has been a success but other areas gradually suffered the same fate and a similar fix has done the trick. I note that Bailey at least do not use polystyrene foam now, a stronger closed cell one is used in current construction.
Your axle should have fixed your original problem of supporting the chassis and floor but it sounds like your floor isn't attached to your wall at it's base at the problem area. That could be rotten woodwork within the floor/wall construction so more investigation is needed, especially as the heavy components of kitchen furniture will exacerbate the problem.
Dave.
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Give a man a fish and he will eat for a day,
Teach a man to fish and you can get rid of him for a whole weekend.
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19/7/2021 at 11:45am
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Hi Jackrascals
As Dave has said its well worth checking to see if the screws which hold the bottom of the wall to the floor batten have sheered, and also the condition of the wall and floor battens.
I had to take the bottom awning rail and trim off to check both on mine, and to get to my screws - quite a few had snapped.
So, I jacked the caravan up and put concrete blocks laid flat fore and aft of the axle on both sides (approx at midway point) and checked using a laser level to make sure the van was completely level on both axis when resting on the blocks.
It was quite clear that the floor was higher than the bottom of the wall in a specific area (like yours around the wheel arch and just forward), so I checked every single screw along that side to check if 1, it had snapped, and 2. if it was corroded. I took an original screw to my local hardware shop and got them to match it.
In the end I had to strip out the entire kitchen and put more heavy blocks on the floor to let it come back down to where it should be over a week.
Once I was happy the floor was back in line with the bottom of the wall, I drilled pilot holes at the mid way point between the original holes (if the original screws could be removed I replaced them with the new ones) and put in the new screws.
One thing I would recommend is putting new stainless screws in where the outer ply covers the floor edge batten - this is to stop the resin / glue leaking out and making a mess on the ground, and it also re-secures that area. Its worth remembering that the reason the floor has sagged is not just because the wall is no longer secured to it on the vertical plane, but because the sandwich floor is no longer bonded in the horizontal plane at two interfaces - where the inner ply sheet is bonded to the top of the polystyrene, and where the outer ply sheet is bonded to the underside of polystyrene.
Where the floor forms the wheel arch well is a particular weak spot due to the loadings, and I rescrewed the ply back into the batten to help give it some more strength. The batten is like softwood roof batten, it has absolutely no strength on its own.
If the floor has delaminated, then even if you have re-fixed the bottom of the wall back to the edge of the floor, it will still sag as before (I know from experience!) due to the floor having no strength.
I'm afraid that if this is the case, you may need to strip some of the van to be able to get the lino up, and start drilling holes in the floor. I ended up doing the entire van from front right back to the bathroom! I didnt know how long it had been like it before I bought it as a fixer upper, so your floor may be in a better condition.
It took me a while to do due to stripping everything out, and re-securing all the cupboards. To give it extra strength, I ordered some quite thick aluminium angle and bought a rivet gun so I could spread the vertical loading over a much larger wall and floor area. You may find that when you start stripping out, that if the floor has moved as much as you say, these brackets may have either sheered the rivets or eaten a hole in the inner ply lining of the wall.
All I can say is my van was like an onion - everytime I investigated one issue, another was lurking underneath!
Take your time, be methodical, buy a swear box and don't give up! Mine has been back on its wheels for a month now, the floor still has a very slight fall away judging by the spirit level, but no worse than the other side.
Good luck, and if I can offer any more advice please let me know!
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20/7/2021 at 10:38am
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You may never know what caused it - potholes, old age, water ingress etc. Once you strip it down, you may get a better idea. My issue was the kitchen is on the n/s of the van, and all that weight on the side of the van which is going to take the most punishment from our awful roads was just too much over time. I think someone smacked a curb or pothole with mine, and all that bouncing around over the years just weakened it.
I almost reached the point of giving up due to the time it was taking, but realised that 1. I cant afford a brand new van and 2. if I buy another used one it could be a complete nightmare as you also mentioned. Plus the wait for brand new vans is extraordinary at the moment - my local Bailey dealer will be putting in orders for 2022 vans next week, and 2023 models in January!!!!!! Bailey are down to just 55% manufacturing capacity as they are unable to source components....
The way I view it is these older vans are built quite well compared to the new lightweight vans (which I hear people stating the quality is not always that great considering the money spent), and if you know your van well, I'd stick with it.
I also changed my tyre size down very slightly from 175/80 to 175/75 R14 98/99 load weight, as they were very tight against the wheel arch (so tight I couldn't get a wheel clamp on!). I also fitted shock absorbers to take some of the strain off the axle.
Its definitely an end of season job, as you will need to take your time. I was lucky as lockdown put the stops on any trips, and I had all the time in the world to fit the repairs around family and work.
The cost of materials for fixing it yourself is cheap, its just the time! That's why caravan repairers charge what they do I'm afraid.
Give it a go, and if done properly the repair should last you a while longer!
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via mobile 18/7/2021 at 7:13am
