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 Topic: frame tent and canvas questions
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12/2/2021 at 1:46am
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I suspect a 1990s frame tent will be cotton canvas pure and simple cotton polyester mix was only just coming into fashion with caravan awnings and marquees I still have a 50 year old canvas frame tent and a 40 year old Litchfield canvas ridge both still usable packing away dry is the secret and the use of a good water proofer when needed uv is your enemy for the proofer, canvas colour will just fade.
Also have to hope its not been cleaned with detergent or been near any young kids blowing bubbles near it impossible to reproof if this has happened to it
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 via mobile 12/2/2021 at 7:27am
Location: Yorkshire
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Like Romany, I believe that a 1990s frame tent is going to have a 100% cotton canvas.
It's not so much a question of how long these tents last but how much use they've had, where (a tent used in the south of France in summer won't last as long as one used in usual summer weather in the UK) and how they've been cared for and stored.
It's not just the canvas you need to check but the steel poles/frame sections. These are usually joined together in sections with springs and have clips. These can stretch or break (easily replaced). Check the coating on the poles because if the tent has been stored in very cold conditions (such as outside in a shed) white rust can appear (poles will have white specks and feel rough instead of smooth and shiny). They will still be usable but damage to the surface is unsightly and will ultimately lead to rust patches.
Most (but not all) frame tents had/have substantial mud flaps which go inside the tent then can be overlaid with a good PVC groundsheet (purchased separately) to reduce draughts. On some, the mud flaps go outside. They will never be as snug or as waterproof/bugproof/draughtproof as a SIG or ZIG but it's how all tents were made back then.
Many frame tents had/have a designated window for the kitchen area, as they can be cooked in (with caution). The bottom part of the window is tough opaque PVC, the top part mesh with an outside cover which can be rolled up or pegged out at an angle (so can remain open even when it's raining).
Some frame tents had roof linings; a polycotton panel which clips up onto the roof framework. This helps to insulate the tent and makes it warmer when it's cold and cooler when the weather is hot. They really do work (you can feel a temperature difference if you put your hand in the airspace).
Frame tents have separate bedroom inners which clip up to the roof frame. Older models had notoriously tight nylon clips which were a devil to get on and off. If this tent has the tight, difficult kind, at least you can now easily replace these with some with more flexibility (different types available).
The beauty of a frame tent is the near vertical walls and good headroom, so no stooping and little wasted space. The downside is pack size and weight (though can be split down to several bags), so think about room to transport and to store.
The very early frame tents were all cotton canvas. Later models (thinking Cabanon, here) had PVC coated roof panels and mud walls, which can be easily wiped clean. It might be argued that a PVC coated roof panel compromises breathability, but these frame tents don't suffer from condensation like synthetic tents do, and the airflow remains good.
You state you're thinking of using an old frame tent in winter. They're strong and sturdy tents. It won't have many guy ropes (possibly only on the 4 corners of the roof) but do use them ad they give additional support to anchor the frame, and do tie the canvas to the frame inside (there are usually tapes on the inside of the canvas, at the edges of the roof panel).
When a cotton canvas tent needs re-proofing (i.e. when water doesn't bead and run off, but instead seeps into the canvas) it's on it's way out. Cotton fibres in a tent canvas should swell when wet and knit together, and re-proofing agents coat and seal the fibres so stop this happening. It also impairs breathability of the fabric. Once you start doing this, it's a process you'll have to repeat. By this stage, you're dealing with a degraded canvas and that can mean it's worn a bit thin, too. We were once pitched next to a very old frame tent in high winds, in Cornwall and the front canvas was shredded; it had worn so thin it just ripped apart. I'd personally never buy a used tent that had been re-proofed (despite that some sellers proudly boast it's been done).
Frame tents really come into their own in summer months: many have front and side panels which can be zipped out or rolled up or canopied out on king poles. Many have optional zip-in annexes, kitchens or canopies. They have great airflow and sizeable bedrooms (often with dividers, so you can adjust room size). They aren't going to blow down or collapse when the weather turns nasty or roast you alive when temperatures soar.
As for EHU, you can run the cable under any part of the tent, no bother. Just make sure the unit is off the ground (clipped to a pole leg or something). You can also easily suspend lights from the frame and place hooks and hangers on the side frame, something I miss on other styles of tent.
Which make and model of tent are you thinking of getting?
Best of luck with it!
Post last edited on 12/02/2021 07:35:47
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12/2/2021 at 12:15pm
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Agree with everything others have said except on reproofing this does depend on what it was reproofed with something like Fabsil (other products available) is Hygroscopic this means it is water proof as in rain will roll off but it has the ability to absorb moisture this allows the tent fibres to expand during bad weather and seal even tighter.
The reason you had to change brake fluid after a few years is because it also is Hygroscopic and a build up of water in brakes is not good.
I have used Thompsons water seal in the past three things wrong with that 1 because its waxed based it increases the canvas weight and decreases breathability by a significant amount, 2 during wet weather the canvas takes on a milky look it does not allow fibres to swell as its wax base, 3 as lidds says you have to re do it about every three years
Post last edited on 12/02/2021 12:33:26
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12/2/2021 at 12:47pm
Location: Devizes Wiltshire
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IMHO, although the flysheet of the tent may be water-tight, without a SIG or ZIG, it will be draughty, especially in windy conditions.
I had a poly/nylon tent without a SIG. Although it had a proper footprint groundsheet that fitted inside, and I used an additional tarp for added protection and warmth underneath, it was very draughty when I camped over the New Year weekend in 2011.
My Dutch cotton canvas pyramid tents had either a ZIG or a SIG, and they were very cosy when I camped in the colder months.
I have not read the other posts in detail, however, another consideration is damp on the canvas at the end of a trip. It is for this reason that I stopped camping in the colder months when I had my ESVO Bedouin 340 tent, as I had difficulties in finding room to dry it after a trip at home.
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20/8/2022 at 10:23am
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Sorry to disagree with some but you should never have to water proof a canvas tent. If its been stored away for a while the fibers shrink. So give it a good soaking and the fibers will swell back up blocking any holes that may have been there.
If for some reason it does rain in its because dirt can cause the holes to not seal and make the water "Wick" through. In this case you need to clean the tent with a specialist canvas cleaner, not expensive .Try emailing the company who make Fabsil, Grangers is the name. They are very helpfull .
If the tent has been Fabsiled so to speak id be wary as it may leak as this would have stopped the holes from sealing up naturally
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