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Subject Topic: Buying a Bailey? Read this first.
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Personmarramc48
29/8/2016 at 12:45pm
 Location: Scotland
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Quote: Originally posted by Compressorman on 28/8/2016

I want one and paid £25k for our new Coachman - I didn't have to pay it - that was my choice.

So in conclusion if you want new then you will pay the price or if not you will have to buy used - but remember you can't buy used unless someone buys it new first.

Regarding quality and value for money - well that's all a bit of a joke.


I agree wholeheartedly with you Mike3003, but as Compressorman states, without people buying new vans, there would not be used vans for the rest of us to buy.

However, when paying £25k to a dealer for a new van, the dealer keeps just over £20,800 and hands over the rest to the dreaded VAT man. That is the main reason why new caravans depreciate so quickly.

-------------
mm48j


Personmisterg
29/8/2016 at 1:14pm
 Location: East Midlands
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I am sure VAT is not that simple?

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Mister G


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PersonMike3003
29/8/2016 at 1:30pm
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Quote: Originally posted by marramc48 on 29/8/2016
Quote: Originally posted by Compressorman on 28/8/2016

I want one and paid £25k for our new Coachman - I didn't have to pay it - that was my choice.

So in conclusion if you want new then you will pay the price or if not you will have to buy used - but remember you can't buy used unless someone buys it new first.

Regarding quality and value for money - well that's all a bit of a joke.


I agree wholeheartedly with you Mike3003, but as Compressorman states, without people buying new vans, there would not be used vans for the rest of us to buy.

However, when paying £25k to a dealer for a new van, the dealer keeps just over £20,800 and hands over the rest to the dreaded VAT man. That is the main reason why new caravans depreciate so quickly.


Yep, you are right, the same as cars. But we never saw a new van without some kind of build quality issue. Our old girl is far better put together and will do us for a few more years.

But, yes, keep buying new so we can buy them in a couple of years much, much cheaper. However I spoke to a person who has been in the trade for many decades when I was thinking of upgrading to either new or a year or two old, they had just serviced my van, she said, and I quote "Don't bother, you have a REAL Bailey already"


-------------
Not ALL Newts get p**sed.

“Semper Fidelis”


PersonCompressorman
29/8/2016 at 7:09pm
 Location: Swadlincote
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Well yes the vat is an issue - but when I said £18k you can include vat in that too - also the dealer would be claiming his £3k plus back for the vat he paid when he bought it - so he gets vat back and only pays the difference - that's how vat works.

Of course the real difference between the build quality of a new van today and a new van 20 years ago is that they were built properly 20 years ago by people who cared a bit more and were given the time to care.

Today vans are thrown together by relatively unskilled workers who don't realy care - they will be on minimum wage and most are probably looking for another better job anyway.

The vans are built in large prefabricated lumps and no one has the time to decide if things are right or not - the assy line has moved on and your next assy needs glueing in.

There is not a lot of hope with the present system and that's what you get.

Now if a company actually hand built a caravan properly they would be able to charge what they wanted - and plenty of people would pay the price - providing it was a top quality product.

I would happily pay the price and there would be a ready made que of people wanting one.

Of course that person may not be you - but that's your choice too.

In the meantime nearly all new caravans are substandard and some buyers are lucky to get a half decent one and the rest get a bad one.

All you need is a battery drill and the DIY skills the people who build them don't have and you can finish your new van yourself.

There is not a lot more to say as this is a very tired topic.


PersonCompressorman
29/8/2016 at 7:21pm
 Location: Swadlincote
 Outfit: Coachman 545 VIP. 2015. View Compressorman's Profile View Profile   Reply to Compressorman Reply   Quote Compressorman Quote  
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Regarding resale values - new vans hold there values very well indeed.
Of course if you need to sell urgently or through a dealer than you will loose plenty.

My previous van was a 2008 Swift - I bought it 12 months old in a private sale from a man who needed to sell urgently - I paid only £8k for it - I can't remember what a new one would have been but a fair bit more than that .

We used it about 8 times a year for 7 years and sold it on privately in 2015 for £500 more than I paid for it 6 years previously.

Also last week I was in a local dealership buying a few bits I needed and on the front was the same van of the same year for £10500

So when I sell my new Coachman when it's 5 years old I bet I get around £18k for it - of course what the cost of it's new replacement will be is anyone's guess.

But that as they say is the name of the game


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PersonCompressorman
29/8/2016 at 7:43pm
 Location: Swadlincote
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Regarding so many people saying that that they prefer their 20 year old van to a new one - that is fine and I fully accept and respect that,

But we also need to realise and accept that many people want the latest new vans full of the latest ideas.

We already know the the vans built 20 years ago had a far superior build quality than one built today - that argument has been already been decided - new vans are nowhere near as good a build quality.

But when it comes to comfort and technology the the old vans are like sheds on wheels.

My new van has proper central heating and superb it is too. The insulation is fantastic. No more cold draughty old vans for me.

The Coachman is so comfortable it can be used 12 months a year in any weather and you will always be comfortable and warm.

Proper cookers and fridges the same as in a modern home.

I have always had new or almost new vans and each one in its day was very good - but the van I had new 20 years ago would not interest me today.

All they need to do with new vans is build them properly - like they did 20 years ago.

Am in St Ives this week and the weather is fantastic.

Caravan holidays for us every time.


PersonOpensauce
29/8/2016 at 8:43pm
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Quote: Originally posted by Compressorman on 29/8/2016
Now if a company actually hand built a caravan properly they would be able to charge what they wanted - and plenty of people would pay the price - providing it was a top quality product.

I would happily pay the price and there would be a ready made queue of people wanting one.

Here yer go...


PersonRay Clayton
30/8/2016 at 4:15pm
 Location: Ilkeston. Derbyshire
 Outfit: Disco 4 Unicorn Barcelona 4 View Ray Clayton's Profile View Profile   Reply to Ray Clayton Reply   Quote Ray Clayton Quote  
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Quote: Originally posted by Opensauce on 29/8/2016
Quote: Originally posted by Compressorman on 29/8/2016
Now if a company actually hand built a caravan properly they would be able to charge what they wanted - and plenty of people would pay the price - providing it was a top quality product.

I would happily pay the price and there would be a ready made queue of people wanting one.

Here yer go...


Nice one.
Just bought my Barcelona 4 year old, great condition, full service history and stating that in 2014 was re-sealed at front with water getting into lockers.
I inspected it out found it to be 50% nearside, 40% offside.
Emailed the dealer (Elldis) i got it from on Sat, and this morning they have arranged for the van to go into a local bailey dealer near me and have the front sorted out on warranty.
Thought about asking for my money back, but quite happy with this van and still have 2 years bailey warranty left.

Same as Opensauce as stated before, if you like it re-seal it. I could go out and get a refund and another van and still find a problem with that one!

-------------
Cheers
Ray

Discovery 4 & Bailey Barcelona 4







PersonCompressorman
30/8/2016 at 10:35pm
 Location: Swadlincote
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Opensauce you have made my day - I will definitely have a look at this company and see what they are like.

The big problem is that they say exactly the same as all the others when it comes to quality and luxury - but you never know - they might do what they say.

You learn something new every day and for that - many thanks.


PersonJTQU
31/8/2016 at 8:09am
 Location: Hampshire
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Quote: Originally posted by Compressorman on 29/8/2016

Now if a company actually hand built a caravan properly they would be able to charge what they wanted - and plenty of people would pay the price - providing it was a top quality product.




Well, there were not enough people willing to pay the price for these beautifully hand crafted vans, and so those builders have all finacially failed. Our Castleton was an example.
But, we live under an illusion older vans were better built, some individual ones that survive today clearly were, but their sibilings have long since rotted away.
Modern construction and materials, mainly the rot free alternatives to wood and the vastly improved bonding sealants give the potential for longer lives; sadly the execution of the build particularly in the UK is I agree dreadfully poor. But, so were a lot of old vans, they just are not around and only the better odd examples are. They also only survived because of owner care in getting them resealed in due time, something now generally not required with bonded construction.


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Personmarkypoos1
31/8/2016 at 2:56pm
 Location: Ipswich
 Outfit: Bailey Unicorn Vigo 2015 View markypoos1's Profile View Profile   Reply to markypoos1 Reply   Quote markypoos1 Quote  
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I have wrote to bailey about a design fault that is driving me mad
The razor sharp heating strip is low in the lockers that my hand keeps getting cut when adding and removing stuff from the lockers. My dealers engineers also cut his hand.
Awaiting a reply from Bailey, 2nd day
My van also left the factory with dents, and various other faults. not good enough especially as its a Unicorn


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markypoos1


Person664DaveS
31/8/2016 at 7:49pm
 Location: Shropshire
 Outfit: Bailey Phoenix GT 75 View 664DaveS's Profile View Profile   Reply to 664DaveS Reply   Quote 664DaveS Quote  
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So why did you accept it? In fact the dealer should have sent it back!

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DS-There's more to life than football!!!


Personromany
31/8/2016 at 10:48pm
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I have given up on caravans over the last two years I have had an Abbey,Elddis,Lunar (well never actually got the Lunar kept delaying delivery) and I wouldn't touch a bailey with a barge pole.

So I have done what many on here have suggested I no longer own or will ever own a caravan again,I have a twenty year old canvas tent it has been through gale force, storm force and guess what it has never leaked or let me down.

Its from the best Tent maker Cabanon.     


Personmarkypoos1
01/9/2016 at 11:05am
 Location: Ipswich
 Outfit: Bailey Unicorn Vigo 2015 View markypoos1's Profile View Profile   Reply to markypoos1 Reply   Quote markypoos1 Quote  
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My email in full to Bailey sent 29 Aug, Still awaiting reply

Hi we have the Bailey Unicorn Vigo and I thought I must right in as yet again my hand has gained another scar from your badly designed heater grill placement.

Why on earth this sharp as a razor device has been put in the cupboards at such a low height therefore playing a roulette wheel of “will my hand get cut or not”, when putting and removing things from the locker

Even if you put a guard around it is inevitable the guard would get in the way of placing things in the locker as the grill is so low.

In my view you should have a total recall of all these vans and move this heating strip up and away from people’s hands.

Even when servicing our van the engineer badly cut his own hand on one of these elements

Enclosed is a photo of my hand

Eagerly awaiting your reply

Mark

Ps also the van when leaving your depot was clearly not inspected properly as I had umpteen problems including dents, doors not meeting the seals, window surrounds not installed correctly etc.

Believe me I am one really annoyed customer.

-------------
markypoos1


Person664DaveS
01/9/2016 at 8:33pm
 Location: Shropshire
 Outfit: Bailey Phoenix GT 75 View 664DaveS's Profile View Profile   Reply to 664DaveS Reply   Quote 664DaveS Quote  
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The heating strips you refer to do seem to have sharp edges on the aluminium plates around them ours are at the back of the boxes and near the top, so I have never cut my hands.
I have had a graze off the catches on a couple of the cupboards, as these are quite narrow, but I now know to be careful.

My hands and wrists are scarred from 24 years working on aircraft-damn locking wire! We often said the designers obviously never serviced the damn things! Same can be said for cars!

-------------
DS-There's more to life than football!!!


PersonJohnMW
09/10/2016 at 8:56pm
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The country is in a state of flux with Brexit - reading the many posts on VAT and labour costs do not be surprised if VAT goes up a couple of notches and with a diminishing cheap labour force the price of a new van and the continental holidays going through the roof at least the UK campsites will see a boom. If you can afford to buy a new van grab it now whilst the pound is still worth something. So stop whinging - you aint seen anything yet.



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