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 Topic: Heating systems in new caravans
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14/9/2010 at 12:10pm
Location: Hampshire
Outfit: Hymer Nova S
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Quote: Originally posted by Viggo on 14/9/2010
Good point - and one that doesn't just apply to the Alde system. My Truma on mains electric delivers hot water at an unadjustable 70C.
Very true and something the caravan industry ought to address before there is an accident but I suppose it needs to be allowed to happen and be followed by successful litigation before anything happens.
The Alde compounds things by boosting up to 80 degrees if on full heating duty, it only backs to 70 when its not pushed hard on the heating. I have toyed with fitting the valve but at £50 I want first to know the pump pressure is adequate for it to work well.
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14/9/2010 at 3:51pm
Location: Hampshire
Outfit: Hymer Nova S
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Quote: Originally posted by Rune Caster on 14/9/2010
Incidentally there is a caravan thermostatic shower valve available which may be a bit more than £50
Fitting a "thermostatic shower valve" is not the logical route as it does not protect the wash basins, kitchen or the vans hot water pipework.
This is more what I have in mind, fixed on the Alde's hotwater outlet:
http://www.screwfix.com/prods/26411/Plumbing/Brassware/Pegler-Prestex-TMV2-Thermostatic-Mixing-Valve-15mm
But I need one that regulates with the order of 0.2 bar pressure loss.
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05/11/2011 at 1:37pm
Location: Cork Ireland
Outfit: Cotswold Celeste 132 & 2003 Navara.
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Hi All,
I have a 1988 +/- Cotswold Celaeste and it has the Alde comfort boiler and I think its great . We used the caravan last xmas in minus degrees weather and it kept our van toasty all the time at the set temp. loads of hot water all the time.
Our control system is basic so it just has a thermostat - no panel for settings, when I first used it it took me a while to understand how it worked and I was lucky I had the manual.When using it now we just let it on set at a temp on the thermostat , when we leave for the day. This means that when we return the van is not cold as the heating will only come on if the temp drops.
My wife is delighted with the system as cold was a big issue before we bought any caravan and I am glad to say, she has never complained about the cold in the van.
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05/11/2011 at 1:53pm
Location: Blackburn Lancashire
Outfit: Coachman Laser 650 and Discovery
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I wonder what weight of water is in it, will that come out of your payload, and will it surge as you tow the van.
Seems a bit odd if you drain your toilet flush tank and all other liquids, but allow heating water to remain.
Jim
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05/11/2011 at 3:30pm
Location: Hampshire
Outfit: Hymer Nova S
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Quote: Originally posted by Greendemon315 on 05/11/2011
I wonder what weight of water is in it, will that come out of your payload, and will it surge as you tow the van. Seems a bit odd if you drain your toilet flush tank and all other liquids, but allow heating water to remain. Jim
About 5 to 7 kgs of inhibited water in most caravan/motorhome systems. No that does not come out of the payload as its part of the "system" so is included within the MIRO.
No it will not "surge" as the only free surface is in the header tank and only has an area of about 2" x 4".
Its not odd that you don't drain it as other water as it will not freeze, its weight is very distributed, has not a free surface as stated and it is deemed a harmful product so nobody ought to simply drain it like water anyway.
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05/11/2011 at 4:03pm
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Our only issue is the control panel and instructions on usage of said item. We have now reverted back to using it manually as no fun waking up at 3am freezing cold because a timer has kicked in. Otherwise much better than our old Truma system.
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05/11/2011 at 4:14pm
Location: NE Lincs
Outfit: Buccaneer Caravel - Range Rover
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I wouldn't now have a van without it. Its great. I'm now on my 2nd van with it. I could never understand blown air systems that had the ducting outside of the van to the rear. It was cold by the time it got there!
Kev.
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05/11/2011 at 4:16pm
Location: None Entered
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I think the reason that the water temperature is kept above 60 degC is to ensure that there is no risk of legionella bacteria growing in the stored water system.The bacteria thrive between 20 and 45deg C, above 60 deg C they are killed.
Saxo1
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05/11/2011 at 9:10pm
Location: Skipton
Outfit: Coachman Wanderer & Audi A6 allroad
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Quote: Originally posted by saxo1 on 05/11/2011
I think the reason that the water temperature is kept above 60 degC is to ensure that there is no risk of legionella bacteria growing in the stored water system.The bacteria thrive between 20 and 45deg C, above 60 deg C they are killed. Saxo1
Don't really think that's an issue
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05/11/2011 at 10:49pm
Location: None Entered
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What is legionella and Legionnaires’ disease?
Legionella are bacteria that are common in natural (rivers and lakes etc) and artificial water systems, eg hot and cold water systems (storage tanks, pipework, taps and showers). We usually associate legionella with larger water systems, eg in factories, hotels, hospitals and museums, and cooling towers, but they can also live in smaller water supply systems used in homes and other residential accommodation. Other potential sources of legionella include spa and whirlpool baths, humidifiers (in factories) and fire-fighting systems (sprinklers and hose reels). Legionella can survive in low temperatures, but thrive at temperatures between 20oC and 45oC. High temperatures of 60oC and over will kill them
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2094925/
There have been several studies done re legionella,the first quote is from the HSE and the link is to a Canadian study.
Saxo1
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05/11/2011 at 11:49pm
Location: Nottingham
Outfit: Discovery 4 + Elddis Crusader Tempest
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Absolutely love our Alde heating system.. Don't bother with timer just set night time temperature and daytime.. Find we switch it to gas for rapid heat then electric for maintaining temp and overnight operation.. Warm within 10 mins on gas.
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06/11/2011 at 8:24am
Location: Cambs
Outfit: Tin tent diddy tent BIG tent
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I found the few minutes spent getting my head around the way the timer works was well worth it. I can set the temp to increase about 6 in the morning so that when I get up an hour later it is lovely and cosy and I have not had to sleep in an unduly warm caravan during the night. If it was an easier system to set I am sure more people would use it. The other great feature worth checking out is the 'Amp' setting where you can set the maximum amount of he electrical supply to the caravan and then if you are for instance on a 10amp supply and have the heater on 2kW and you switch on a kettle etc the power to the heater will automatically be reduced to keep the overall load within the set figure.
Downsides, on gas it uses a massive amount in very cold weather, and spiders seem to love the flue for making nests. The only other negative is down to the caravan manufacturers and that is the Alde system has a feature to include underfloor heating which is great and actually reduces the amount of heat you need to put into the caravan to feel warm, but for some reason I think there are only a couple of UK companies using it although in Europe it is common on the higher end models. Maybe as people realise the winter caravanning is viable the pressure will be put on manufacturers to install it. In the meantime I will have to stick to my electric undercarpet heating in the winter.
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06/11/2011 at 8:58am
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Quote: Originally posted by stephenn280575 on 05/11/2011
Quote: Originally posted by saxo1 on 05/11/2011I think the reason that the water temperature is kept above 60 degC is to ensure that there is no risk of legionella bacteria growing in the stored water system.The bacteria thrive between 20 and 45deg C, above 60 deg C they are killed. Saxo1
Don't really think that's an issue
It is an issue with his system, and it does state this in the manual,
There is a setting on the control box to run the pump from time to time to stop this.
Myself love this type of heating, no cold spots in the van,every part of the van gets heat, yes as said, takes 20,30 mins to get the heating warm, but As said a fan heater till it's gets warm.the digital. controller looks complicated when you first clamp your eyes on it, read the manual at the same time as you are setting it up and it comes so easy, once it is set, it will keep these settings.
It's been said that you can run gas & 240v at the same time, my heating only allows you do this if it is really cold,the Alde 310 combi gives you
Max gas power output: 5.5 kW (propane), 6.4 kW (butane)
Max electric power output: 2 kW (UK spec) or 3 kW (European spec)
Max gas consumption: 405 g/h (propane), 460 g/h (butane)
Gas pressure: 28-30/37 mbar (I3+)
Fluid capacity: 8.4 L (fresh water), 3.5 L (glycol)
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Roughing it in style at Calloose caravan and camping holiday park nr St Ives.(seasonal pitch)
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06/11/2011 at 6:03pm
Location: UK
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Alde control panel.
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