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Subject Topic: Ace Caravans?
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04/3/2011 at 11:57am
 Location: South Ayrshire
 Outfit: Burstner Belcanto 535
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As a very long term member on Ebay I can say categorically that the alleged spirit of Ebay has long, long gone and it has long been no more than a simple venue for selling, rather than a true auction site where you pay your money and take your chances with no backing out. The big draw it does have is that it is the biggest venue around by far.
Besides, the elusive 'spirit of Ebay' is all very well when you might lose just a pound or two selling an item below value. But believe me, when faced with a shortfall of some £2k - £3k in what you are selling it tends to reduce your compassion for 'buyers' who are hoping you are some kind of village idiot prepared to give your item away to them. In those circumstances as far as I'm concerned, if they are so avaricious, they can bleat as much as they like.

I objected to giving Ebay another £30 in fees just to put a reserve on my caravan. Naively, I thought my caravan would comfortably get to within £2k of the lowest forecourt price I could find (esp. with a new motor mover) making a reserve unnecessary.

Trying to sell my caravan on Ebay was quite educational. Traders were clamouring to do me a favour by taking it off my hands for a pittance (using the famous "Well no-one's really interested in this model guv" routine). Whilst 'private' buyers who contacted me were extreme; wanting auction lowest price with minimum auction risk and max. private buying safeguards, e.g. wanting inspections after sale, the right to reject if they did not like it when viewed, and the right to re-negotiate price down if inspection showed anything 'amiss' (a stone chip not mentioned in ad. perhaps?), etc.   

No doubt someone will sanctmoniously respond with the usual 'prices reflect market pressures'. To that I suggest they take a look at the prices asked on Ebay, Auto-Trader et al. for older, smaller, less-featured and probably well-used caravans than mine and then, hand on heart state they would not have pulled the auction as I did!


04/3/2011 at 12:47pm
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Well, welcome to the world of diy caravan selling, bit of a bearpit ain't it? It is for this reason many folk just take the hit & trade in. The low price of your trade in offer is basically the fee the dealer charges you for taking all that hassle out of your hands.

By your own admission you did not set a reserve to avoid the extra fee & then pulled the listing when it looked unlikely the price you wanted would not be reached.

This sort of thing is of course common practice as is schill bidding. You coming on here to 'defend' yourself against your 'detractors' is somewhat pot-kettle-black imho.


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04/3/2011 at 12:57pm
 Location: Lancashire
 Outfit:  Volvo X60 Coachman
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Why not advertise it as a classified ad on ebay, i did this for a pal last year i think it was £30 or £35 for  2 weeks.

It worked well he was happy with the outcome it sold after 2 adverts so £70, I think that was cheaper than doing a auction

Bessie   



04/3/2011 at 1:52pm
 Location: Kingswinford west mids
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Think the guy did right, came on here to straighten things out honestly,well done.

-------------
Newquay in Wales 2011.


04/3/2011 at 2:05pm
 Location: South Ayrshire
 Outfit: Burstner Belcanto 535
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My initial posting had nothing whatever to do with defence of my cancelling an auction - an aborted auction from which only I and no-one else incurred expense. I posted to point out the ridiculous inferences being drawn by some folk for the flimsiest of reasons, not to defend my stopping an auction that was going no-where fast.

You decided to raise issues of schill-bidding and other Ebay selling practices, not I. Quite honestly I do not care if I have offended sensibilities for not being willing to sell my caravan at a ridiculously low price. But to draw inferences of foul practices, secretly being a dodgy dealer, schill bidding and so on, for doing so is absurd.


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04/3/2011 at 2:27pm
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Quote: Originally posted by Starbj on 04/3/2011My initial posting had nothing whatever to do with defence of my cancelling an auction - an aborted auction from which only I and no-one else incurred expense. I posted to point out the ridiculous inferences being drawn by some folk for the flimsiest of reasons, not to defend my stopping an auction that was going no-where fast.

You decided to raise issues of schill-bidding and other Ebay selling practices, not I. Quite honestly I do not care if I have offended sensibilities for not being willing to sell my caravan at a ridiculously low price. But to draw inferences of foul practices, secretly being a dodgy dealer, schill bidding and so on, for doing so is absurd.

I take my hat off to you. I'd have done exactly the same thing. Its your property, so you have the right to do exactly as you like with it. As you said no one lost out but you on the extortionate and unrealistic ebay fees,   Exactly why I NEVER sell on Ebay anymore. Total ripoff and full of very unscrupulous buyers who can put any old comment about you on feedback yet you are only allowed to post positive. Ebay = Rubbish.

I dont blame you one bit. Why not advertise it on the free ads on here and on Gumtree. At least you'll not be out of pocket.

-------------
Always forgive,Never forget;Learn from mistakes,But Never regret;People change,Things go wrong;Just remember life goes on

Cool campers use Delta Pegs.

The happiest people aren't the ones who have everything they are the ones who make the most of everything they have


04/3/2011 at 2:30pm
 Location: South Ayrshire
 Outfit: Burstner Belcanto 535
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Just to conclude, I reproduce here the exchange of messages between me and Taz, the original poster. If anyone can find anything sinister within the answers I gave then I wish they would point it out to me! -

" Dear starbj,Hello,
I live on the East Coast of Scotland and won't have the opportunity to view before bidding. As I am sure you will appreciate I am a little bit nervous about bidding thousands of pounds on something I haven't seen! If I win the auction would you accept the purchase is subject of of a pre-purchase inspection (at my expense) for damp etc. by an MCEA (http://www.mobilecaravanengineers.co.uk/mcea-find-an-engineer.htm)?
Also am I correct in saying the caravan doesn't have an awning?
Thanks Taz****"

" Dear taz***,
Thanks for enquiry and I do understand your caution.
At present with a huge number of 'watchers' but lack of bidding I am inclined to end the auction early. As you'll appreciate I do not wish to risk or intend letting a high quality caravan go for a ridiculously cheap price.
Having said that, I would have no objection, in principle, to an inspection subject to a reasonable deposit being paid at close of auction to show real intent to buy - deposit refundable if anything is found substantially not as described (e.g. it would be unreasonable to cancel the sale because a stone chip was discovered that wasn't mentioned, or something equally minor on a 6 year old used caravan). I would also add that the auction price will be non-negotiable; it is not uncommon for inspection engineers to be geared towards finding faults which are really non-faults as price reduction negotiation tactics to justify their fees. It is not normal to inspect post-sale in an auction, because auctions offer lower prices than classified sales for a 'certain sale' (which is the advantage for the seller, a quick, no quibble sale at a lower than market value).
I am a private seller of a personally owned caravan and you'll see by my feedback I am well regarded (esp. see the comments from the buyer of my prev. caravan in Apr 2009) - and I wish to retain my good reputation. The only faults I know of are: a v.small mark on the surface of the laminate door for the fridge; I am missing the alarm keyfob (never had it and it never bothered me because the 'van is stored v.securely); there is a crack in the plastic lens of one of the rear lights which is hard to see, and the leisure battery is probably nearing its end!
Doubtless, there will be other very minor items for anyone looking hard enough, but nothing of any real consequence I am certain.
Finally, there is no awning, simply because the 'van is more than enough space for just the wife and myself.
Starbj"

" Dear taz***,
Sorry to have to withdraw the caravan from auction, but have decided to keep the caravan. The level of bidding was such that I would probably have ended up paying much more for an older, smaller, less well-featured caravan than I would have got for mine, which of course makes no sense.
Again, sorry if this disappoints and good luck in your search.
starbj"

Although not necessary, out of plain coutesy I also contacted all 3 bidders with a similar explanation for stopping the auction.


09/3/2011 at 9:27am
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Quote: Originally posted by Starbj on 04/3/2011
Oh what a lot of armchair experts and gold medallists at jumping to conclusions - wrong ones as usual!
The Ace Prestige 65 on Ebay is mine - me aged 60+ a private individual with an exemplary feedback history on Ebay. How some folk can translate my buying and (minimal) selling record of all kinds of things into me being an Arthur Daley selling a dodgy caravan is so comical.
The Ebay posting was pretty clear and invited viewings and questions from anyone interested; I've owned the caravan for 2 years, using it has confirmed it is too big for just wife and me (we bought if because it was a good deal when we up-graded from our old Swift and we were simply seduced at the time by the roominess); the motor mover was fitted just because it is big to push around!. Cleanliness and carpet cellophane in photos is because we look after our caravans.
Wife and I eventually admitted it is really too big for us so advertised on Ebay stating very clearly we really preferred to do a deal with someone with a smaller van, rather than sell. All this was in the ad!!
As for bidding - that was nigh on non-existent. 2 or 3 bidders took price to around £5500 in 6 days. With just over 12 hrs left on the auction (& you cannot stop an auction with less than 12 hrs left)I cancelled the auction rather than risk my excellent cossetted van not even achieving £6000. I decided to keep my 'van (& I still have it).
Upon what evidence some can see fake bidders, shyster dealers and all the rest I fail to see.
All very sinister indeed for all you conspiracy theorists though I suppose!!

Whats the sellers age got to do with it ???

its taken two years to find out its too big  ?? quite clear you jumped into buying it as it was prob a good deal.

two years depreciation at 15% per year works out that you paid 8K in 2008 ?? then if so it books you at £5700 hense your start price of 5K if you seek 6K start the bidding at that. and as you are keeping it it will book at 5K end of year plus storage insurance etc add to the figures the holidays had away best rethink what you value it at and what its actually worth.  its well known that prices fly in the last couple of hours on FleaBay.

back to my figures of it being worth £6700 tops  if with Good Awning. so I advise you stop trying to save the reserved price fee on Ebay and advertise it trully. we both know its worth 7K on a good day from a dealer with warranty some more if exceptional and fully loaded etc.

buyers are more than fed up with chancer sellers who are unclear in their requested price.

as to insulting bids thats part and parcel of selling on FleaBay

the OP had a budget of £7500 so I guess she has had an escape. hope she has had a lesson in life.



Post last edited on 09/03/2011 09:36:30

Post last edited on 09/03/2011 09:51:17


09/3/2011 at 3:31pm
 Location: South Ayrshire
 Outfit: Burstner Belcanto 535
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Quote: Originally posted by D Mansworth on 19/2/2011
Quote: Originally posted by Sproz on 19/2/2011
You will probably find that a friend was bidding it up, then he decided to finish the bidding early, either because the rightful owners returned home!! or it was sold on his plot, he sold another van just before this one, also plastic on the carpet tells me its on a dealers plot.

well spotted and investigated. that must be the reason.  yet another case of an ebay account shafting the buyers.

there should be a black list of these sellers. other than the feed back syatem as it plainly fails to work !




Oh dear, I take you are miffed because your earlier expert utterances above have been shown to be wrong.

I shan’t reiterate my reasons for buying the caravan and then, after using it, realising it was not really suitable for the wife and me. If my previous explanation was too difficult for you to understand, then there’s no point. How long we take to decide a caravan is unsuitable is ours alone and none of your concern.    

Likewise, my pointing out the comedy and irony of an OAP (mention of age) ‘ducking and diving’ on Ebay robbing innocent bidders also seems to have escaped you. My Ebay feedback is 100% on over 250 transactions with all sorts of mixed items, of which 30 only were sales. Furthermore, I have never placed a reserve on any of the items I sold & have only ever withdrawn 1 item from sale – the caravan. So upon what basis do you feel justified in writing, “…there should be a black list of these sellers. other than the feed back syatem (sic) as it plainly fails to work !”

I repeat again, I have no concerns whatever for unrealistic Ebay bidders who scream ‘foul’ when they cannot get something at a silly price. Unlike me, who had to pay to list the item, the most they lost when they bid was a little misplaced optimism in the expectation of a getting an incredibly cheap item.   How tough for them and heartless of me!

If I bid on an item on Ebay that does get withdrawn (probably because buyer is uncomfortable with bidding levels) I don’t give it another thought – I am able to move on and find another of whatever I am looking for. Why get all bitter and twisted as you obviously do because you cannot ‘steal’ an incredible bargain?

I do, however, resent the statements and implications of ignorant people of dishonesty, misrepresentation and other shady practices, which you endorsed. Upon what evidence? Because I was not prepared to sell at too cheap a price? My last posting illustrates I was open and explicit with the OP and the only 2 other bidders during and after closing the auction.

I would remind you that the OP only wanted to know about Ace caravans and mine in particular, and most people on here being helpful gave useful hints and suggestions. I do not recall seeing anyone inviting baseless, inaccurate and unnecessary character assassinations, which some opinionated folk posted anyway.

As for your incredible valuation on my caravan – ridiculous. Show me anywhere this model/year (or even the lower spec Jubilee Courier) can be bought at your valuation (try Googling the model – there’s a few being advertised).



09/3/2011 at 3:44pm
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http://www.caravanpriceguide.com/index.html

and

http://www.c4caravans.com/touringcaravan-ace-londongreater98316.php

and

http://www.northamfarm.co.uk/usedvans/caravan.php?id=2732

and I rest my case 



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09/3/2011 at 3:52pm
 Location: South Ayrshire
 Outfit: Burstner Belcanto 535
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Very selective - the first one is so obviously a scam at £3500 anyway, you should recognise that as the Ebay expert & the second is damaged.

What about all the others advertised you've left out;

http://www.caravanselecta.co.uk/touring-caravans/ace/ace-prestige-65-2005-sale-was-cs226042.aspx

http://www.caravanselecta.co.uk/touring-caravans/ace/ace-prestige-65-cs189270.aspx

http://www.caravanfinder.co.uk/caravan/Trade/0425A51B8993673B802577C700427320/

http://www.northamfarm.co.uk/usedvans/index.php?category=2





Post last edited on 09/03/2011 16:20:45


09/3/2011 at 4:22pm
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gosh this is getting tiresome!   the OP requested advice and it was given by several alas it was in some part to your detriment. as you pointed out in your post you are a mature adult so get over it life is too short.


09/3/2011 at 4:29pm
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I entirely agree, it is tiresome, but can I just point out it was you posting wrongful accusations and the you who decided to post yet again when the topic had gone silent!!

Try being objective and less judgemental when you do not have any evidence.


09/3/2011 at 4:34pm
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Quote: Originally posted by Starbj on 09/3/2011
I entirely agree, it is tiresome, but can I just point out it was you posting wrongful accusations and the you who decided to post yet again when the topic had gone silent!!

Try being objective and less judgemental when you do not have any evidence.

must remember not to be away from the computer for a week.  I have more than made my points fact. its your good self thats got too hot for good health on the subjuct.  in life we get knocks accept!

its been fun though!   all the best




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