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Subject Topic: Tyre Pressure
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21/7/2014 at 10:25pm
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[QUOT]Originally posted by larkspeednl on 21/7/2014


That means to get an accurate reading of pressure you want the van loaded and sitting fully on it's wheels



I dont want to start an argument but i would say your wrong
If you got a balloon and put 10psi in it...and if you squeeze it hard it will show more than 10psi till pressure is released.Its the same with a tyre.


Ive never in all my years of caravaning have i come across a van which said the tyres when empty should be blown to X amount and fully laden blew up harder.
The tyre pressure they give is for both weights van empty or full.

To me your loading the van and causing the balloon effect and while you have the recommended pressure in the tyres your letting them down because of the weight on them....







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Animals have feelings..

JEFF................


21/7/2014 at 10:35pm
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Everytime you get car tyres fitted, they are inflated to the correct pressure off the car, or they should be. Nothing changes when you put them on the car...


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21/7/2014 at 10:41pm
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Correct as the balloon effect has been considered ,

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Animals have feelings..

JEFF................


21/7/2014 at 10:50pm
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Quote: Originally posted by Bob61 on 21/7/2014
Quote: Originally posted by larkspeednl on 21/7/2014
But even just using them as steadies the way they are intended they still take some of the weight and therefore reduce the weight on the wheels.

The steadies shouldn't take any weight at all. You only lower them sufficiently to just touch the ground and prevent the caravan from rocking backwards and forwards when people walk inside. The weight of the caravan is all on the wheels

if you put down your steadies before the van is packed for travel any weight you add to the van goes on the steadies not the wheels.

No, it goes on the wheels. However, if you load the caravan significantly then the tyres will obviously 'spread' which in turn may put pressure on the steadies but I would suggest if you are loading your caravan to that extent it will be very much overloaded

That means to get an accurate reading of pressure you want the van loaded and sitting fully on it's wheels



The weight of the van doesn't make any difference to the air pressure inside the tyre because the air is spread evenly throughout the tyre. Pressure on the tyre at one point simply expands the tyre elsewhere...or I'm talking a load of codswallop





Sorry I would have to disagree, once you put the steadies down so they touch the ground no more weight can go on the wheels simply because the steadies are touching the ground.

The steadies don't compress to allow the van to place the weight on the wheels, if they did they would be useless, the frame may flex slightly but not enough to make a significant difference.




21/7/2014 at 10:55pm
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Quote: Originally posted by jeff juke on 21/7/2014
[QUOT]Originally posted by larkspeednl on 21/7/2014


That means to get an accurate reading of pressure you want the van loaded and sitting fully on it's wheels




To me your loading the van and causing the balloon effect and while you have the recommended pressure in the tyres your letting them down because of the weight on them....





Again a jumped conclusion, at no point did I say I was letting any pressure out of the tyres all I said was I was raising the legs before making sure they were at the correct pressure.

But since my original question in this thread was answered some time ago and the conversation has just continued based on false assumption and since I have no desire to sit here going around in circles.

I'll just say thanks for the input and head out of this conversation


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22/7/2014 at 12:32am
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I was finding it quite an interesting debate with the differences of opinion giving food for thought.


22/7/2014 at 12:47am
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Quote: Originally posted by larkspeednl on 21/7/2014

Sorry I would have to disagree, once you put the steadies down so they touch the ground no more weight can go on the wheels simply because the steadies are touching the ground.

The steadies don't compress to allow the van to place the weight on the wheels, if they did they would be useless, the frame may flex slightly but not enough to make a significant difference.




Yes, I can see that. In fact if you put weight inside the caravan the suspension will lower and yes, I can see that pressure will then be on the steadies. However, if you then wind the steadies up slightly the full weight is once again totally on the wheels.

Likewise, when you arrive at your destination and set up your caravan, then unload heavy stuff, you may have to re-adjust the steadies to touch the ground again.

I don't think it will have any effect on the tyres though and as I originally suggested there would need to be a lot of weight to make a big difference I would think.



22/7/2014 at 8:39am
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No,what you did say is this..

"That means to get an accurate reading of pressure you want the van loaded and sitting fully on it's wheels"

You want the tyre pressures checked when the van is empty not when you have loaded it.

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Animals have feelings..

JEFF................


22/7/2014 at 11:14am
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tyre pressure or the tyre pressure needed is all about the weight the tyre has to carry..

there is a direct connection between weight and tyre pressure the tyre also has to be built strongly enough to hold that pressure which is directly connected with the weight the tyre has to carry..

my van tyres are max rated at about 730 kg per tyre or 1460 per axle..

to carry this maximum weight they need inflating to their maximum pressure which is 65 psi.. its all linked..

my van weighs fully loaded around 1100 kg.. i could blow my tyres up to 65 psi but in dont.. i could blow them up to the van makers recommendation of 56 psi but again i dont i blow them up to between 40 and 45 psi.. this is about the correct pressure the tyres need to be at to carry the weight they have to carry..

this is also at a speed rating of 90 mph.. being as my van never goes more than 60 mph i have a built in safety margin over an above that built into the tyre..

some folks think the harder the better i think no more than is needed..

in fact i do a lot of slow speed country lane touring bumpy roads and pot holes.. i think for me 35 psi would be correct for the slow speed bumpy roads and maybe 45 psi for the smoother 60 mph type roads..

but i havnt a clue what i am talking about so best to carry on doing your own thing.. he he..

adding more weight to a tyre will cause the pressure to go up.. add enough and the tyre will probably go bang.. the variation in caravan loading isnt enough to make much difference..

the makers of my caravan (now defunct) seem to think 56 psi is the correct pressure for the entire range of their single axle vans.. from 800 kg up to 1300 kg.. quite clearly they are just being lazy or trying to avoid confusing their customers.. threads like this make me see why.. he he

instruction have to give a figure.. its usually a safe enough figure but more often than not its not the best figure.. its given because a figure has to be given..

trog

ps.. why dont i just use the maker 56 psi figure.. because the basic suspension of my caravan is far to hard for bumpy roads.. running the tyres harder than they need to be means my flimsy caravan is more likely to suffer damage from the potholes i aint clever enough to miss.. i use my tyres as part of the vans suspension..   



Post last edited on 22/07/2014 11:24:04

Post last edited on 22/07/2014 11:32:25


22/7/2014 at 11:57am
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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wOHSJ7zUBIA

"adding more weight to a tyre will cause the pressure to go up"

Not according to the video above.

I think Boyles gas law explains it but it is 60+ years ago that I left school.
saxo1


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22/7/2014 at 3:21pm
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it probably depends how much the tyre can expand..

but as the weight presses down on the tyre it will try and flatten the bottom bit.. the air from the flattened bottom bit has to go somewhere.. the space for the air to occupy gets less.. the pressure must go up..

its like a piston.. adding weight will cause the pressure to go up.. with a car tyre the rest of the tyre can probably expand enough to not cause much of a pressure difference under normal circumstances..

its not the sort of thing i have put to the test that often.. he he

but if you squeeze the balloon enough it will go bang.. i cant see a tyre behaving any differently..

i could be wrong of course but i dont think so.. he he

i have a boat trailer with 13 inch wheels at 90 psi.. i am sure if i kept adding weight eventually those tyres would go bang.. if it isnt the extra pressure (caused by the extra weight) that would make the tyres go bang i cant see what else it could be..

i get into some daft arguments at times.. tis a weakness of mine.. he he

trog


22/7/2014 at 5:30pm
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What people don't seem to understand when they get a puncture is that the tyre is only flat at the bottom, the rest of the tyre is fine.


22/7/2014 at 7:52pm
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the snag its its only the bottom bit that does anything.. he he

trog


23/7/2014 at 12:14am
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All very confusing me thinks!

A lot of it caused by the misconception it's pressure that carries the load which it ain't!... it's volume of air that supports the load... the pressure you put in then is simply the result of forcing that required volume of air into the available volume inside the tyre.

Next, does it matter if you check it fully loaded, or empty, or indeed with some of the load sat of the steadies?!!
No not a jot, the tyre is not a balloon it's a very strong mesh of woven fibres and sometimes steel covered in rubber, it is simply not designed to expand, (to any real degree), under pressure. So if it's flat at the bottom the sides have deformed and the volume inside has not changed... so neither then will the pressure.
.................

Trog, I assume you have 175R13C 97 load index tyres and if so? for 1100 kg load you need 46psi, 56psi is actually correct for 1295kg?.
I agree with you though, given your not doing 90 and in truth rarely getting near 60!... a couple or three psi lower is exactly what I use and give the van a softer ride over bumpy roads


23/7/2014 at 11:24am
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Quote: A lot of it caused by the misconception it's pressure that carries the load which it ain't!.


you are wrong with that one.. its is the air pressure that carries the load.. nothing else does.. he he

if there isnt enough pressure the load isnt carried and the tyre goes flat at the bottom.. the greater the load the greater the pressure needed to carry the load..

the tyre does two things.. it grips the road and it contains the pressure needed to carry whatever load is placed upon the tyre.. one other thing it does is to lessen bump shocks.. tyres with air in them are far better at doing this than sold ones.. which is why its counter productive to blow the things up harder than have to be to support whatever load it is they have to carry..

the pressure within the tyre will equalize it isnt greater at the bottom than the top but you are correct in there being many misconceptions about tyres.. or tires as the americans call them..:)

two things come to mind.. batteries and tyres.. both things in regular use and both things most people dont have much of a clue about.. he he

trog



23/7/2014 at 5:24pm
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This is getting tiring



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