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Subject Topic: is it an earlier end to caravanning?
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via mobile 18/11/2020 at 4:20pm
 Location: Shropshire
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I suspect that pressure from the motor industry and oil companies will be applied, as 9 years maybe insufficient time.
The self serving buffoons in Westminster can be voted out,or will change their tune if they are likely to be!

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DS-There's more to life than football!!!


18/11/2020 at 4:21pm
 Location: south derbyshire
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Whilst I am not against electric vehicles I think they have a place alongside diesel and petrol vehicles, this latest idea from the government raises some issues.
In no particular order
Will the infrastructure be built in time
Who will pay for building the infrastructure we are already losing billions to the pandemic
Power stations and nuclear power stations that produce electricity also cause pollution
Current vehicle batteries are not easy to dispose of at the end of their lives this will be a problem in years to come
How will the government replace the revenue lost from the tax on fossil fuels
I would like the government to answer these questions I get the feeling they can't at the moment, I wouldn't be surprised to see in about 2028 the date put back !


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18/11/2020 at 6:18pm
 Location: East Herts
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Quote: Originally posted by Graham T on 18/11/2020
Whilst I am not against electric vehicles I think they have a place alongside diesel and petrol vehicles, this latest idea from the government raises some issues.
In no particular order
Will the infrastructure be built in time
Who will pay for building the infrastructure we are already losing billions to the pandemic
Power stations and nuclear power stations that produce electricity also cause pollution
Current vehicle batteries are not easy to dispose of at the end of their lives this will be a problem in years to come
How will the government replace the revenue lost from the tax on fossil fuels
I would like the government to answer these questions I get the feeling they can't at the moment, I wouldn't be surprised to see in about 2028 the date put back !



I'm not against electric vehicles either, but I don't think they are the answer to all the problems.

No, the infrastructure will not be built on time, I think we can be certain of that.
Who will pay for it? Everyone.
Replacing the tax lost? Either huge increases in road tax for electric vehicles, or road pricing for all vehicles with no exemptions for electric vehicles. Anyone who thinks that EVs will remain cheap to run is deluding themselves. They are only as cheap as they are at present because they only make up a tiny proportion of cars on the road. Once they become more main-stream, costs will rocket.

In my opinion there will still be both petrol and diesel vehicles around for the next 30 years at least. It's highly unlikely that I will be though, so I don't think I will ever see the end of them.

What about all the other applications of diesel engines, including trucks, tractors, heavy plant, trains, and ships? Cars are the tip of a very big iceberg.


-------------
Best Regards,
Colin


18/11/2020 at 7:25pm
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"Who will pay for building the infrastructure we are already losing billions to the pandemic"
Cancel HS2 that would cover it!
saxo1


18/11/2020 at 8:03pm
 Location: West country
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Actually I think charging could be achieved for EVs.

Most electricity metering now is transmitted to the supplier via the mobile phone network using a dedicated sim card. I'm sure a link could be established between an on road (not at your home) charger so the power used to charge can be sent to the supplier.
Power used for charging at home can be uploaded to the system.

That way, the EV user can be charged for the cost, the charger supplier can be reimbursed and power used for charging at home charged at a rate higher than the electricity cost to account for the current fuel duty.

I think its important to keep a link between miles driven/fuel used to limit the number of miles driven as now and to make those who use the most pay the most.


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18/11/2020 at 9:17pm
 Location: East Herts
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Quote: Originally posted by navver on 18/11/2020
Actually I think charging could be achieved for EVs.

I think its important to keep a link between miles driven/fuel used to limit the number of miles driven as now and to make those who use the most pay the most.



Navver you could be right about the charging, only time will tell.

I think it's important that those that use the most, pay the most too, but governments in this country don't seem to be quite as bothered about it. Road tax is the perfect example of that. I can see them taking the easy option of simply upping the road tax for EVs. They have always seemed to prefer to tax ownership of a car rather than use of one, or they would have done away with road tax and put it on fuel.


-------------
Best Regards,
Colin


via mobile 18/11/2020 at 9:28pm
 Location: Lancashire
 Outfit:  Volvo X60 Coachman
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I personally think that all cars should pay a standard road tax & have a disc in the window to prove it, a simple system that worked for years.
If need be increase the road tax for large 4x4 type vehicles not by doubling or tripling but by 1.5 Times the standard.
Any foreign cars pay per month if found without tax scrap there cars. Simple.

Bessie


18/11/2020 at 10:27pm
 Location: East Herts
 Outfit: 1992 Elddis Wisp 450CT + X Trail
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I must say I don't agree with that Bessie. Why should someone who does only 2,000 miles a year or less, pay as much in tax as someone who does 20,000 miles a year or more? My late Mother-in-law, when she drove, used to do about 8 miles a week.

I have never agreed with taxing ownership of a car. In my opinion, the more you use it, the more you should pay. My car is quite thirsty compared with many, my choice, so I expect to pay more when I use it, but why should I pay anything while it is sitting on my drive? Also, there are several ways some people manage to avoid paying road tax, even using false plates, but there is no way anyone can avoid tax on fuel.


-------------
Best Regards,
Colin


18/11/2020 at 10:42pm
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It should be possible to charge by the mile by the cars mileometer or on board computer/sat nav etc.
saxo1


via mobile 18/11/2020 at 11:01pm
 Location: Lancashire
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Colin we already pay tax on fuel along with everything else, the more miles people do the more they pay in tax,
As fair or unfair as it is we all as motorists have to pay for our highways.

Bessie


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18/11/2020 at 11:10pm
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Of all the taxes on fuel and road fund licences less than 25% is spent on the highways.
saxo1


19/11/2020 at 12:07am
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A work colleague of mine who lived about a couple of miles from work always used to complain about the problem of driving to work because of all the people living in the countryside driving into town. He, his wife and each of the two offspring all owned cars and all drove into town individually within a few minutes of each other.
He also claimed make those who travel furthest pay more, that would get some of the cars off the road.
I suggested to clear the roads more, charge by the number of cars in each household. Low for first car then double tax up as another car was added. He went absolutely berserk, much to everyone's amusement, which was exactly why I suggested the idea.


19/11/2020 at 11:07am
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Quote: Originally posted by Ancient Uncle on 19/11/2020
A work colleague of mine who lived about a couple of miles from work always used to complain about the problem of driving to work because of all the people living in the countryside driving into town. He, his wife and each of the two offspring all owned cars and all drove into town individually within a few minutes of each other.
He also claimed make those who travel furthest pay more, that would get some of the cars off the road.
I suggested to clear the roads more, charge by the number of cars in each household. Low for first car then double tax up as another car was added. He went absolutely berserk, much to everyone's amusement, which was exactly why I suggested the idea.



Driving into town separately does seem a bit crazy, but I wonder if they all were going to the same place? Maybe they needed their cars for some reason, were going on to different places, or were coming back at different times? Would make a bit more sense then.

I still say the use of a car is what matters, not mere possession of one. If you are going to use the roads you pay, if you are not using them you don't. Put the tax on fuel. I say that even though I drive what some might call a gas-guzzler. Only thing is I'm not sure how we could apply that to electric vehicles.


-------------
Best Regards,
Colin


via mobile 19/11/2020 at 11:11am
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We have 2 cars, our choice. Neither do a huge mileage as we are retired.(especially this year!). We are paying road tax for vehicles parked on our property! I could Sorn one, or buy a classic with no road tax!
I can't see why EVs do not pay road tax as they use the roads!

-------------
DS-There's more to life than football!!!


19/11/2020 at 11:25am
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Quote: Originally posted by 664DaveS on 19/11/2020
We have 2 cars, our choice. Neither do a huge mileage as we are retired.(especially this year!). We are paying road tax for vehicles parked on our property! I could Sorn one, or buy a classic with no road tax!
I can't see why EVs do not pay road tax as they use the roads!



Oh they will! You can be sure that this situation is only temporary. The number of electric cars on the road at present is tiny, but once they start becoming significant they will start paying tax, of that you can be certain. There is no way the government is going to lose all the revenue they generate from petrol and diesel vehicles, both from road tax and from fuel tax. They won't be able to tax the electricity they use as it would put the price of electricity up for even those without cars, so it will all go on road tax. Governments always go for the easy option. No road tax on EVs is just a ploy to get everyone to switch, then once they have, road tax will start to be charged, and because of the inability to charge tax on fuel, road tax will be much higher than it is now on petrol and diesel vehicles.



-------------
Best Regards,
Colin


19/11/2020 at 11:45am
 Location: Lancashire
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Quote: Originally posted by Colin21 on 19/11/2020
Quote: Originally posted by 664DaveS on 19/11/2020
We have 2 cars, our choice. Neither do a huge mileage as we are retired.(especially this year!). We are paying road tax for vehicles parked on our property! I could Sorn one, or buy a classic with no road tax!
I can't see why EVs do not pay road tax as they use the roads!



Oh they will! You can be sure that this situation is only temporary. The number of electric cars on the road at present is tiny, but once they start becoming significant they will start paying tax, of that you can be certain. There is no way the government is going to lose all the revenue they generate from petrol and diesel vehicles, both from road tax and from fuel tax. They won't be able to tax the electricity they use as it would put the price of electricity up for even those without cars, so it will all go on road tax. Governments always go for the easy option. No road tax on EVs is just a ploy to get everyone to switch, then once they have, road tax will start to be charged, and because of the inability to charge tax on fuel, road tax will be much higher than it is now on petrol and diesel vehicles.





True that's why all cars should be taxed, Then every car driver pays.
I think we all know that EV drivers will pay tax eventually it's just a enticement to get people to go Electric.

I know these cars are expensive but the savings are quite dramtaic, I filled my car last week for the 1st time in 6 weeks, the cost was £35 in petrol, I used to put £50 a week in my mondeo so 6 weeks = £300 thats a straight £265 saving,

On average that should save me around £2300 per year since i keep my car for 4 years that should save me over 9k   

Bessie



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