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This scam is happening all the time in the caravan sales outlets. Since I was taken for a ride by a certain caravan dealer I have spoken to a great number of persons who have been drawn into this dreadful practice. It goes off all the time. Don't believe me then get yourselves down to the your local dealer on a Saturday morning arround May/June time when customers are bringing thier caravan in to trade up to a new one. Just stand back and watch. As they hand over thier old caravans they are ushered into thier new one to be shown over it. At the same time a guy with a damp meter is into the old van. As they go into the office to pay off the outstanding balance they are informed that the caravan has damp and the exchange price has to be adjusted. (I bought this caravan new and it had always been serviced by this dealer) 

The price of the caravan I was purchasing was over £20,000 and they were asking for  £250.00. I said to them we had allready done a deal several months before then they showed me the smallprint on the agreement which I had signed when handing over my deposit of £500 which brings this damp clause to light. I asked to see the M.D. and he was adamant that I had to pay it.So I then agreed to pay it if he through in a free service when due. He refused. I told him the deal was off and asked for my deposit back. He then informed me that as I was breaking the contract I would lose the deposit. We paid up.

I visited my solicitor and he informed me I was wasting my time and good money pursuing it through the courts. I wrote to several caravan magazines they did not even reply. I gave p.

 As for caravan I purchased thats another saga.

Over 20 faults on delivery and more to come. When I wrote to the Swift Group complaining and asked them about quality control and the so called PDI this is the reply I got.

"I cannnot excuse the fact that your caravan has not reached you in a condition that we would both expect. However, I have passed on your comments to our Quality Department for their information. Checks are made throughout the manufacturing process and this procedure is completed by the dealer at the PDI"

In other words see your dealer they sold you the caravan.

Who is the dealer? I will give you a clue.

There is a racecourse just South of Scotch Corner in North Yorkshire.

Just want to add my thoughts - now I'm presuming that your parents paid via a credit card? If thats the case can they not contact the bank/finance company whom issues their card and ask them to stop the payment if it has not already gone through?

Might be worth a try whilst they contact the Trading Standards etc.

I'm horrified at the Dealers comments - I live locally to Huddersfield and am only aware of a couple of dealers in this area.

I'm a bit concerned here.

It seems that by stating the area in which this rogue dealer is located, a perfectly innocent dealer is being caught up in this.  I think this is unfair and if  was that innocent dealer and read this, I might be getting some legal advice pdq.

If this ever happened to me, I would walk away from the whole deal.

I would rather lose my deposit than get ripped off by some low life ex-car dealer.

Dealers, especially national ones, are only interested in making money. I have always found that a local company treats me with respect and aren't happy until I am. I have found such a dealer and won't go to anyone else.

This is the first time I have heard of a caravan dealer ripping someone off. I know of plenty of horror stories in the car and motorcycle trade, but you don't really expect it to happen to the likes of us!

Sod it! Name and shame them!

Quote: Originally posted by Briarose on 16/1/2006

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Hi Frome I posted that a few posts back..........as it isn't fair on others.

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We traded our van in against a used one and was given a price on seeing photos.  When we took it in it was checked over and found damp at the front and we pinted out other bits that we had already told them about.  Our deal turned out ok there was no quibble what so ever about price, well pleased.

Go back often just to look and for service and can't fault them always happy to stop and have a word with you and be recognised.

"which the dealer had offered £2,900 for. While they where being shown a demonstration of the new van their old van was being checked over and it was not good new!! "

Tracey,

The contract was made on the prices as written. Neither your parents nor the dealer had any right to try to change the contract without the agreement of the other party ie a new contract.

The dealer could not demand extra money unless he could prove that the trade in was materially different from that described ie earlier model or substantially different condition and even there the onus is on him to sue your father for misrepresentation after the standing contract rather than what happened.

Caveat emptor or buyer  beware also applies to the purchase as a trade in is a purchase by the dealer and the courts are very strict on this. The dealer is always seen as responsible for ensuring the bought in goods are satisfactory, he is the expert.

The defect alleged ie damp could clearly be expected in a van of that age or any van not used for a month or two so would not justify a breach of contract. Your father gave no warranty.

Finally, the dealer had no right to demand the cost of the inspection that he carried out for his benefit. Pointing at the small print on the contract he had just breached would be no justification for impounding the van. If it was printed on the order it would be dismissed under the Unfair terms contracts act. Your parents had not agreed to pay for that inspection unless it was discussed and agreed before signature.

My advice would be to visit the dealer with your parents and discuss their grievance calmly and rationally. You could put it to him that it has also been discussed on here and what happened is not reasonable.

This should not be relied upon and qualified advice can be given by a Solicitor or CAB.

Quote: Originally posted by gowser on 16/1/2006

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traffic officers can and do issue prohibition orders on vehicles and or trailers deemed as not roadworthy or dangerous so strictly speaking parts dont need to have fallen off just look like they are ready to or have been neglected. There is a get out clause on the MOT certificate that states that this is not a certificate of roadworthiness. There is also an offence of having something on or above the highway to the danger of other road users, this is mainly used for idiots who stick traffic signs or other road furniture in the middle of the road after a drunken night out. Not surprisingly there is a power of arrest.

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I was lead to believe that a prohibition order, i.e  a GV9 could only be used on vehicles with an MOT, as a GV9 works by revoking that vehicles MOT.  Ill have to research this more thouroughly.

Simple answer I guess is make sure your outfit is fit for the road before you set off.

Anway,  sorry im HI-jacking this thread!

Tim,

you are not hijacking this thread, the original post contained the comment from the dealer that the caravan was unroadworthy and they wouldnt let them take it on the road and the thread has included advice reagrds your rights and who can and cant prevent you from continuing your journey.

 My point was the issuing of a PG9 prohibition notice that allows you to continue your journey and have up to ten days to rectify the defects. You are quite correct that the vehicle must have an mot to be enforced but a trailer either an HGV or caravan has to be towed by a vehicle covered by an MOT.

This is why more and more of us caravaners are falling foul of  prohibition notices for lighting, brakes, tyres and loading offences at roadside checks. But I would think that a police or VOSA officer would struggle to justify that a bit of damp constitutes unroadworthiness of the caravan as stated originally by the dealer. So another point in favour of any civil action taken by the original posters parents

I hadnt heard of a PG9,  I have only experienced a GV9. A Truck I was driving once  had a GV9  prohibition order imposed for no brake lights (fuse) I had to have a police escort to a car park where it could be left, and it couldnt be moved until a mechanic had fixed the fault and the ministry and police had made sure it was ok, only then  was I allowed  to continue.  Just for good measure they then stipulated that the lorry had to be moted again within a week or so, this cost alot of  money with the lorry being off the road, steam cleaned  e.t.c.

While the GV9 was in force, the lorry couldnt be moved, unless it was on a low  loader, or wed be in big trouble.

If, for example a car and caravan  has a  GV9 order imposed on it for faulty lights on the caravan,  the GV9 order would be imposed on the tow car pulling the caravan, as the caravan has no MOT. Could the tow car be then swapped for another  vehicle and the journey continued?(as the "new" tow car would  have no prohibition order) the vehicle with the GV9 order on it  would then have no  faults as it  would not be towing the caravan and would have to have the GV9 lifted.

Tim,

a GV9 is an immediate removal from the highway notice normally imposed for serious or dangerous defects, I can only assume that the brake lights failure was deemed as serious as vehicles behind you would be unaware that you were slowing down and so effect their reaction time. A PG9 notice allows you to continue your journey and have the defect repaired and a new MOT issued  even if the defect was with the trailer or caravan and not the towing vehilce.

and if that hasnt bored everyone to bits and killed this thread here is the REALY boring bit sorry

Section 69 of the Road Traffic Act 1988 as amended by the Road Traffic Act 1991 provides for Vehicle Examiners and Authorised Constables to prohibit unfit vehicles from being driven on a road

the act defines a vehicle as motor vehicle and any trailer/caravan being towed by that vehicle, so even if the defect is on the caravan the prohibition notice covers the car and the caravan.    

Aaaah, i see!

Thankyou Gowser.