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Despite several years of camping under canvas we're considering buying a caravan although its proving hard work finding out what costs need to be considered first;

Looking to buy a 4-6 berth caravan in the region of £1500-2000 - not a problem to look via ebay etc.

Insurance -  for a 10-15 year old caravan what sort of cost would we be looking at annually?

Towbars & electrics - Ive read that its possible to fit removable towbars (car might need to be upgraded within a couple of years so I don't want to pay out large sums only to give it all away when I sell the vehicle!) - how effective are these & are they any good?

Storage - appears that insurance companies are only interested in insuring if stored on an approved site - is this actually the case or am I looking in the wrong places?

I would appreciate any help anyone can offer!

Thanks

Steve

Caravan Insurance

Storage - appears that insurance companies are only interested in insuring if stored on an approved site - is this actually the case or am I looking in the wrong places?

not true most are not concerned within reason if all locks are added,ours is on the drive.

Looking to buy a 4-6 berth caravan in the region of £1500-2000 - not a problem to look via ebay etc

keep to 85% of cars kerbweight when buying to be safe on tow,ie tail not wagging the dog.

damp is your main worry so buy a meter before you look

Buying Secondhand

Quote: Originally posted by steve2009 on 05/1/2011

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Insurance -  for a 10-15 year old caravan what sort of cost would we be looking at annually?

For that value of van I would expect something in the £125 - £150 range depending on which discounts you qualify for, such as security, secure storage etc..

Towbars & electrics - Ive read that its possible to fit removable towbars (car might need to be upgraded within a couple of years so I don't want to pay out large sums only to give it all away when I sell the vehicle!) - how effective are these & are they any good?

You can get detatchable towbars so not permanently on vehicle but the complete kit is normally matched to the car make and model. You may be able to re-use electrics and some components but I would expect to have to buy some fixings for new car.

regards

Tony

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I think the term "removable towbar" is normally used about the visible part - towball etc. To remove a complete towbar you would have to get a towbar fitter to unfit it. Could be done yourself with knowledge & facilities. It is probably then unlikely that it will fit your upgraded car and there is not much of a secondhand market for towbars.

I believe my last towbar fitted was about £300.

There are a lot of "hidden" cost involved in owning a caravan but a lot of these will be one off's like the wheel locks for the insurance but you are probably looking at about £100+ a year for insurance.  Even though you are going for an older 'van will you want it checked and serviced each year?  A service is in the region of £100-200 plus parts if anything needs replacing.  Brakes and tyre prices are similar to car parts so need to be factored into your budget.  Are you allowed to store or have space at home to store your 'van otherwise storage costs can add a lot to the yearly price.  Towbars are about £150 - £250, wheel locks can cost up to £100, hitchlocks about the same.

What car do you own?  Have a look on what tow car to see what 'van your car will tow.  You'll need the basic details of your car and 'van.

hth :)

http://www.whattowcar.com/  look at this link and you can cheke what the towing data is on any caravan you are concidering to buy, also cheke on your picaso  mach to caravan.

The cris number may not be on a caravan of the value you state, but if it is then it will be etched into the window, it is so you can cheke a few thing about the caravan like if it is nicked.

It is like a registration number.    go for it steve enjoy and happy hidehis for yrs to come and cheep lol

PS, bill of sale with the sellers name and address

Quote: Originally posted by steve2009 on 05/1/2011

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Thanks for all the advise on here - plenty to start investigating!!
My car is a Citroen Picasso 2.0l Diesel 90 2005
Whats a CRIS number?

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Here are some of the legals to consider when buying a van. After all you are talking of a lot of money so need to get it right

Buy from a dealer and you will be protected by a whole raft of consumer legislation. The van must be fit for purpose; it must be free from defects; it must be as described; the dealer must own it etc etc. Buy privately and all you have is “caveat emptor” – let the buyer beware. You are on your own and if you buy a defective van that’s your fault and not the sellers. You have wasted your money and have very little redress against the seller, unlike the position when you buy from a dealer. 

All is not doom and gloom buying privately. Not all sellers are out to cheat you, most are decent reliable folk. Buying privately and you can get a better financial benefit. What you need to do, though, is to be well armed, to protect yourself. Many folks, and web sites, will give you good advice on the practicalities of buying e.g looking for damp, but very few, if any, will tell you the legal side of buying which you also need to observe.

Hope these few notes will assist.

Get it in writing

As I said you are basically on your own, legally, if there is something wrong with the van. However, you can protect your position to some degree. When you question a seller on any specific point they do have to be honest in their reply. Insist that any claims they make about the van e.g “There is no damp”, are put in writing and signed by the seller, so that you have some redress in law if any such claims are subsequently found to be false.

CRiS Registration

Any caravan manufactured after 1992 will have its VIN registered under the CRiS scheme. The 17 digit VIN number (usually starting with an SG) is stamped on to the chassis (A Frame) and on later models etched into the windows. So check that the number on the window corresponds with that on the chassis. Rub your fingers over the number on the window. They should stand out. If they don’t its a transfer or some other kind of alteration suggesting a stolen van.

Ask to see the CRiS registration document and check the name and address of the owner. Is that the person you are talking to and are you at the address on the certificate? If someone offers to bring the van round to you to look at, or maybe on some waste land, it may just be stolen.

Carry out a check at CRiS (01722 411 439) /HPI check  (http://www.hpicheck.com/caravans.html) before you pay. This check will confirm the true identity of the van as well as report if it has outstanding finance, reported stolen, or has previously been recorded as an insurance write off.

You will want the top of the CRiS registration document on completion of your purchase. The bottom is a tear off strip that the seller completes and forwards to CRiS to confirm that they have sold you the van. Better still get them to complete it and take it from them so that you send it to CRiS.

Without adequate identification some insurers e.g CC will not insure your van.

You could also us the CC Theftcheck services at 01342 336885

Service History

Check the service history. A genuine seller should have a copy of all of the service receipts and the service engineers checks, plus, their handbook should have been stamped by the service company. Check that that company actually exists. For newer caravans (up to five years or whatever the warranty period is) it is usually a condition of the warranty that the van is serviced each year so check that the seller has complied with that condition. The service history will also show that a damp check has been carried out and the date of that check. ENSURE THAT YOU SEE THAT PART OF THE ANNUAL SERVICE DOCUMENTATION.

It may be prudent to take the van to a dealer for a full service before you use a second hand van

Electrics/Gas

For newer vans there should be a certificate confirming that these have been tested and that they comply with relevant standards.  Ask to see it. These can be lethal pieces of equipment if they are defective or poorly maintained. If there is no recent certificate, say, in the last three years, then ask for these items to be inspected and a certificate issued. If any defect arises then you need to know. It affects price (work may be needed); your decision to buy or your life! A major revision of gas systems, with the adoption of European Standard ‘EN1949’ for 2004 model year caravans may suggest buying a van manufactured no later than that date.

Ask the seller to show you everything actually working. No sparks from shorting electrical appliances. See that the gas flame is blue - any other colour and you have a problem e.g Carbon Monoxide (take the edge of your holiday)

Tyres

Check the tread and ensure that it is at a legal depth. Check the tyre walls. Cracking of the tyres’ walls means the side walls are damaged and could blow any time. Read this

http://www.caravanclub.co.uk/nr/rdonlyres/aa21c69d-adcd-4264-9be5-090bdec6ef81/0/tyresandwheels.pdf

In particular understand what all of the figures on a tyre mean. They tell you the date and thus the age of the tyre. If its more than five years old, good practice recommends that it be replaced. It will tell you the pressure of the tyre. If its about 32psi  for a van with an MTPLM of 1500+Kg then it’s the wrong tyre and you would be towing illegally and probably messing up your caravan and car insurance, as well as putting you and your family at risk. Also check that the tyre is right for the max load of the van.

If there is a spare does it match the wheels on the van in terms of size pressure rating etc?. Some manufacturers who supply alloy wheels on the van will use steel tyres rather than alloys for the spare. The actual tyre should match though

Brakaway cables

These should not be rusty, worn or damaged and should run freely. Give it a good look over and a couple of pulls.

British Standard

Try to buy no further back than a 1999 model. At that time the British Standard BS 4626 was replaced by a range of European standards for caravans. These covered improvements to safety, durability, electrical installations and ventilation. Conforming caravans are marked with a badge containing the NCC logo and the standard number ‘EN 1648’ below it.

Warranties

Many vans sold privately are advertised as being “within warranty”. Usually wrong!!! Not that anyone is trying to con you, they just do not understand how warranties work. Warranties are generally personal contracts for the benefit of the original purchaser of a caravan. In the last two/three years manufacturers warranties have become expressed to be for the benefit of the owner “for the time being”. That means that the benefit is with whoever owns the van and whether they were the original purchaser or not. READ THE WARRANTY AGREEMENT. As a general principle of English law unless the warranty/guarantee says otherwise the benefit of a warranty can only be transferred to another person in writing. So, read the warranty, if it can be transferred (assigned) the warranty should say just what process is required to legally transfer that warranty. If you look at this thread

http://www.ukcampsite.co.uk/chatter/display_topic_threads.asp?ForumID=8&TopicID=229452&PagePosition=2

you will find a form of agreement for transferring a warranty. You should always send a copy to the company who provided the warranty and there may be a registration fee to pay. Don’t overlook this process. If you have to make a claim it annoys when the manufacturer refuses to deal with you because their contract is with someone else. Remember that the equipment in the caravan may also be under warranty. The owner may have taken out an extended warranty if the van is more than five years old. Find out if he has.

Buying from a dealer and you will get  a warranty.

Handbook

Don’t forget to ask for this together with handbooks for all of the equipment in the van. A conscientious owner will have all of these. If they do not have such documentation this may suggest that it is stolen or that the owners were not too fussed about looking after the van

Payment

When it comes to parting with your money make sure that you get the van at the same time. The seller will have a different view. If you are paying by cheque then the seller will want the cheque cleared before he lets go of the van.  During that clearance period could he do a runner with your Van? What security do you have? Can you trust the seller?

You can pay cash but that means carrying a lot of your hard earned through the streets. From the sellers perspective he many not want cash as payment of that into a Bank may lead to an investigation as Banks have to ask all sorts of questions to ensure that money laundering is not taking place.  There is also the issue that anyone asking for cash may just be a bit on the dubious side. One option which may be suggested by the seller is that you provide a Bankers Draft which is a cheque from your Bank and not your own bank account. It’s as good as the actual cash. The seller knows that it will not bounce. It will cost you to get your Bank to issue a bankers draft. Another option may be a CHAPS payment. You and the seller tell your respective banks that you want to make a deal via a CHAPS transaction just a few days before you are to pick the van up. On the day of collection you both go to the sellers’ Bank and you give him a cheque which he pays in and then you both go off and have a cup of coffee for an hour or so whilst the Bank does the electronic transfer of the monies. Best to ask the bank how long it will take. Then back to the Bank and the Bank will confirm that the money has been transferred into the sellers’  account and you get the keys. Again a fee is payable, around - £20-30ish. Be prepared to deal with the sale in this way.

Don’t forget to ask for a receipt giving the seller's name and address, date, make, model and year of caravan, the amount paid, and is signed by the seller

Tow Vehicle

Ensure that your existing car can legally tow the van you hope to buy. Check out its kerb weight and, in accordance with recommended practice, pick a van that has an MTPLM (fully loaded weight) at about 85% of that kerb weight.

Ensure that you have the correct Tow Ball for the kind of stabiliser the caravan has.

Ensure that the van can achieve the correct nose weight for the car/tow ball. It is illegal to exceed that nose weight.

Storage

If you plan to keep the van on your drive, check your title deeds. There may be a restrictive covenant against keeping caravans on the drive. Parking the van on a highway may be deemed an obstruction and you may find that it gets towed away. There may be local Byelaws prohibiting the parking of caravans in an area that you propose to use. Check these things out if you are not to use secure storage

Insurance

Compare polices from a number of companies to find a policy that suits your proposed use of a van. Read the policy to see just what you need to do to comply with the policy. If you do not comply then the policy will be invalid. e.g use of wheel and hitch clamps. Advise your car insurers that you have had your car modified by the addition of a tow bar and that you will be towing a caravan.

Have fun

Phil

I think that was a brief summary.

Jim