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Subject Topic: Caravan and Covenants Post Reply Post New Topic
06/11/2014 at 8:15pm
 Location: West Sussex
 Outfit: Caravan
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I have previously owned and van and kept it at the back of my property on communal land owned by the residents association that I am part of. This van I had for about 5 years. Then is died and I had no van for about 2 year then this summer purchased another one. I put it on the same piece of land and I have just received a letter from the residence association that has asked me to remove it. Also included was a copy of the covenant saying that 'no caravan, temporary structure, or building other than a Garden shed or green house shall be kept, allowed or be erected on said land.'

I offered to put the van into my garden and have been told to refer to the covenant again because I can't do that either! The residence association are a limited company which where formed when the housing association sold the 21 houses and the land around them to the residence in 1981. These covenants are on the original deeds and the ones for the transfer over in 1981.

Please can someone tell me if there is ANY way around this. The caravan was a present, we both work and have a young family and a mortgage which means things are pretty tight and if we have to pay to store the caravan it will make keeping it unaffordable...which also means selling it in winter!! Thanks in advance.


06/11/2014 at 8:37pm
 Location: None Entered
 Outfit: combat shorts and flip flops
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Can you park it on the public road outside your property


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06/11/2014 at 8:40pm
 Location: West Sussex
 Outfit: Caravan
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Is it okay to park them on the road. Most of the road is private but the top park isn't :)


06/11/2014 at 8:53pm
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Dont know but lots kept on road


07/11/2014 at 12:14am
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if it isnt causing an obstruction its okay the same rules apply to parking a caravan as to a car..

trog


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07/11/2014 at 7:08am
 Location: Hampshire
 Outfit: Hymer Nova S
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Not the advice I got from my local police.
We had our access blocked by a parked vehicle, so were forced to park in the lane we live in.
The police were involved sorting out the parked car, but advised me that while they were getting this sorted I had to leave my caravan coupled to the tow car whilst it was on the public road. I could not use my car until they had the offending vehicle removed.

So for leaving your caravan on the road , if Hampshire police were right, then it must be coupled to its tow vehicle.


07/11/2014 at 7:50am
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"if Hampshire police were right, then it must be coupled to its tow vehicle."

maybe they were not right.. but technically any vehicle parked on a public road could be said to be causing an obstruction whatever it is which does tend to leave the ball in the policemans court.. :)

but apart from the obstruction thing there is no law stopping people from parking a caravan on a road attached to a tow vehicle or not.. you may be asked to move it you may not.. it depends on the policeman and the circumstances..

trog



07/11/2014 at 8:01am
 Location: NE Scotland
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AFAIK a caravan may be parked on a road but during darkness must have road lights on.
If that's right, to be legal,it would be possible to fit low energy LED lights and couple them to the leisure battery. Would be a job for an auto-electrician unless you are handy.

-------------
playing at tinkies


07/11/2014 at 9:14am
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It depends if covenant is actually enforcable. One way around it might be that if you are part owner of this land then(possibly)there has to be agreement between all owners of the land before covenant can be enforced.

You could also point out to them that if they force you to move your caravan then you could buy a motorhome of twice the size, park it there & as it is a motor vehicle they can do nothing.

If you park on any public road then it is only at descretion of police/parking wardens. If they decide you are causing an obstruction then you are so they can stop you parking unhitched caravan on public road in this way if there are complaints which there probably will be.

I think the way forward here is discussion, offer to park it in your garden instead of shared land & so on. I guess this is the result of just one person complaining so its up to you, tell them you have no where else to store caravan & go from there. It is up to those complaining to find out if enforcement is possible.


07/11/2014 at 11:57am
 Location: Derbyshire
 Outfit: ElddisAvante462 Honda CRV SE2.2 i-Dtec
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Enforcing a covenant would involve using a solicitor and taking it to court in most cases, something that will cost the group money to enforce unless they happen to have a Legal Eagle amoungst them whos willing to do the necesary work for free. The thought of a large legal bill is enough to put most people off persuing such a claim beyond the type of letter they have already sent you.

I agree though that keeping your caravan on your own land within your garden with suitable screening provided by hedges and fences instead of on communial land used by the community in general would probably win you more favours in the eyes of the law should the matter end up in court, which l very much doubt that they would pay out of their own pockets to do.

Julia

-------------
Just love to be out amoungst Nature and Wildlife

Celebrating 37 years of Caravanning in 2019, Recently Considered Retiring, but Totally Addicted for Life!


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07/11/2014 at 5:07pm
 Location: Rayleigh Essex
 Outfit: Currently looking
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Are you leasing your house/garden from the Residents Association or is it your own garden? and do you own the freehold. If you own the freehold then I am sure that the residents association couldn't prevent you from keeping your caravan in your own garden if you own that land. What may be a sticking point is if access to your garden is via the communal part of the land that the residents association own.

Polite dialogue is so important request a meeting of the residents association state your case and circumstances and ask maybe for a vote. Once people are in a setting like that it is far harder for them to object in person.

Failing that you may have to seek proper legal advice or maybe go and speak to the CAB. Some local solicitors offfer free advice for 30 mins as a way to advertise their business. We have used that option once to return a faulty car and the advice we received in those 30 mins worked



07/11/2014 at 8:33pm
 Location: Staffordshire
 Outfit: Freelander 2 2.2GS
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I would think that you are probably on a loser in trying to park it on communal land with the covenants in place.  To be honest I think you have to look at it from both points of view - what if a whole bunch of residents decided to buy vans and park them up there, it could end up looking like a campsite.

As for parking it on your own garden, the same covenants would apply but unless the residents or the Housing Association were prepared to fund a legal action against you, which would probably cost a fortune, you may well be okay to go ahead provided you have private access that didn't involve towing it over anyone else's property or the communal land.

Personally I wouldn't risk leaving a van parked up on the highway - that is likely to annoy neighbours more than leaving it where you are now, and runs the risk of plod getting involved. 



07/11/2014 at 11:14pm
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Quote: Originally posted by richardstolemysoul on 06/11/2014

Please can someone tell me if there is ANY way around this.




This is almost certainly not what you want to hear - but the short answer is almost certainly 'no'.

The only way around that type of restrictive covenant is to secure a variation in your favour. Developers of new homes always reserve themselves the right to modify or vary covenants in order to protect their own interests from unforeseen circumstances.

If a builder want to sell a property they might agree to vary a covenant that forbids caravans, for example. some do this - but many will not for fear of setting a precedent and antagonising other residents

However, such a variation (if granted) is strictly limited to the specific property and to the first owner of that property.

Co-signatories to the covenant have no power whatsoever to modify it or vary it in any way.

You read it, you agree to it, you sign it, and you are bound by it.

What's more, any signatory to the covenant can enforce it if they choose to do so.

As a hypothetical example, consider an estate of 1,000 houses covering a large area with multiple roads. If the covenant forbids the parking a caravan (for example) and a signatory to that covenant breaches it, they can be held in breach by *any* of their neighbours - even if that neighbour lives half a mile away and never sees the offending caravan form one year to the next.

Objectors do not have to prove any personal inconvenience or loss of amenity - the fact that they are co-signatories to the shared covenant is enough to give them the right to sue for any breach.

Now, perhaps the most important thing is to appreciate that if a covenant is breached and one or more of the neighbours decides to take it to court, they WILL win - absolutely, categorically, 100% cast iron, guaranteed.

The Judge might privately think that the complainants are being obnoxious, officious, meddlesome - whatever, but the simple fact that the covenant is breached will allow him/her to deliver only one judgement - and it *will* be against the person who has breached it.

Further, costs will be awarded, and the entire affair will be an absolute financial nightmare, costs of around £20,000 would not be unexpected.

BEWARE of anyone who tells you that you have a chance of winning if you are in breach - you will not!, and you will be held liable for all costs,

That, of course, presupposes that action would be taken - if no-one cares, then you will be left alone to quietly continue breaching the said covenant.


However,from your post it appears a certainty that legal action would be commenced - and those who launch it will also have been advised that they cannot lose!

Sorry for the bad news - but it's important to know which of life's battles can be fought and won, and sadly this is not one of them.







08/11/2014 at 12:03pm
 Location: Southport
 Outfit: Mondeo Titanium Swift Challenger 580
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Does the covenant stipulate how big the garden shed has to be?
You can see where I'm going here, surely the covenant doesn't restrict what you keep in the allowed shed.



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