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Subject Topic: Leisure battery
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Personlynn and ray
via mobile 18/1/2021 at 8:39pm
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Hi a few weeks ago we went to the storage to check on the caravan everything ok,we went again on Saturday and while checking the solar panel unit nothing was on,so we checked to see if we could put on the 12volts system nothing was working there aswell,we brought the battery home put it on charge but with in half an hour it said it was fully charged trouble is we carnt test it cause we haven't got a multi metre to see what the voltage is,I always thought the solar panel would keep the battery charged up,would the battery be flat?


PersonColin21
18/1/2021 at 10:57pm
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Sounds to me like the battery is knackered and won't hold a charge, which is why it appeared to be fully charged in only half an hour. Solar panels don't give out much of a charge at this time of year, so it probably wasn't putting much into the battery anyway, which could be why the battery has had it. If a battery has been left in a discharged state for any length of time it will very quickly deteriorate and become useless. I don't think I would want to rely on a solar panel to keep a leisure battery charged at this time of year. Fine in summer, but the days are simply too short in winter.


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Best Regards,
Colin


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Persontango55
18/1/2021 at 11:41pm
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The battery could very well be flat but have a look at the battery condition gauge as a guide first to see what that reading is. If the battery indicates on the meter as being flat then it's needs to be confirmed by the aid of a voltmeter which for under a tenner is a valuable gadget to have. As mentioned previously, being reliant on solar panels at this time of year with less daylight hours and reduced light by dull skies etc. is without doubt going to cause some battery issues. When sulfation is activated, the life of the battery is somewhat reduced when the sediment finally makes contact and short circuits the internal lead plates causing battery failure. The advice is to charge the leisure battery via a smart charger which extends the life of the battery which taken into consideration the cost of a smart charger and a voltmeter is far cheaper than the price of a buying a new battery. At the end of the day a leisure battery needs a lot of TLC disregards how old it is so having the right equipment is paramount and in the long term saves money.


Persontrog100
19/1/2021 at 12:17am
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even a knackered battery will show a full charge voltage when put on a charger..

a multimeter wont tell you much.. you need to put a known load on it to see how long it takes to go flat..

lets say an old car headlamp bulb.. this would draw around 5 amps for example.. doing this is the only way to tests a batteries true capacity.. a good 100 ah battery should run a headlamp bulb for getting on for 20 hours..

most lead acid batteries are at least half knackered its just the owners dont know it.. he he

you can buy proper capacity testers but they are not cheap.. i have one you set the amp draw and leave it running.. 10 amps is a good test load.. it records the amps taken out and the battery voltage..

trog


Post last edited on 19/01/2021 00:22:36


Persontrog100
19/1/2021 at 1:06am
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an ebay battery capacity tester.. about £35 quid-ish

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/150W-Constant-Current-Multifunction-Electronic-Load-Battery-Capacity-Tester-USB/293889702486?ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT&_trksid=p2057872.m2749.l2649

trog


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PersonFrancais
19/1/2021 at 10:28am
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Yep trog100, that is very similar to the type that Will Prowse often uses, of course with a LA battery you have to factor in Peukert's law when testing for capacity under load, note quite so with a LiFeP04 battery.


Persontrog100
19/1/2021 at 11:53am
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the thing is Francais lead acid batteries start to wear out as soon as they are used.. the only way to test actual capacity along a batteries journey between being bought new and being chucked out is to put a known load on it and measure what comes out..

its a simple process.. fully charge the battery.. put the known load on it and see how long it takes to go flat.. there is no need to be exact.. a rough idea would be good enough..

trog


Post last edited on 19/01/2021 12:03:45


Persontrog100
19/1/2021 at 12:08pm
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another useful cheap tool.. an ebay watt meter.. you fit it to your van or whatever..

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Digital-DC-Watt-Meter-12v-24v-48v-Voltage-Current-Battery-Monitor-Solar-Power/254103933935?ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT&var=553444987277&_trksid=p2057872.m2749.l2649

trog


PersonColin21
19/1/2021 at 10:51pm
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That watt meter looks like a useful bit of kit, Trog.


-------------
Best Regards,
Colin


Persontrog100
20/1/2021 at 4:50pm
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very useful colin.. not a bad price as well.. i have a couple so i know they work..

trog


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Persontrog100
20/1/2021 at 5:07pm
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a link to the ebay lithium batteries i bought.. they are a direct replacement for a 120 ah lead acid battery.. normal lead acid chargers will charge them fine..

expensive up front but they should last for many years..

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/100Ah-12V-LITHIUM-LiFePO4-Battery-for-Leisure-Solar-Wind-and-Off-grid-12-volt/131402654613?ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT&_trksid=p2057872.m2749.l2649

trog


PersonFrancais
20/1/2021 at 5:49pm
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It’s good to see these 100Ah LiFeP04 drop in replacement batteries coming down in price, although the big brands like Renogy (Pouch Cell form 32 cells) and RELION (Cylindrical cell form 120 cells) are still around double the price of the one in Trog’s link, which presumably is a Prismatic cell form (4 cells).


Persontrog100
20/1/2021 at 7:04pm
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i dont know what is inside the ones i bought francais.. they are basically generic chinese made batteries..

they seem okay.. i recently ran a capacity tests on them.. i have two batteries in parallel.. 200 amps in all..

i pulled 100 amps from them.. 10 hours at 10 amps.. i used the capacity tester i have linked to..

after the test the batteries showed 13.1 volts or about 3.25 volts per cell.. this is slightly over 50% charged..

i couldnt be arsed to run then fully down but i consider the test a pass..

i have also (using a 1000 watt inverter) tried running a 1000 watt fan heater plus a 600 watt kettle.. both worked fine..

half the price of what you can pay but i am happy with them..

trog


Persontrog100
20/1/2021 at 7:18pm
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some other stuff i have recently bought.. part of my solar install

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Renogy-20Amp-12V-DC-to-DC-Battery-Charger-Marine-RV-Van-Dual-Battery-Maintainer/124453765511?ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT&_trksid=p2057872.m2749.l2649


https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/20-40-60-80A-MPPT-12-24V-Solar-Panel-Battery-Charge-Controller-PV-10pcs-Screws-I/312794884118?ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT&var=611527638215&_trksid=p2057872.m2749.l2649

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/1000W-2000W-Peak-DC12V-AC-240V-PURE-SINE-WAVE-POWER-INVERTER-WITH-DISPLAY/192291242782?ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT&_trksid=p2057872.m2749.l2649

i would recommend all of them..

trog


PersonColin21
20/1/2021 at 8:02pm
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Quote: Originally posted by trog100 on 20/1/2021
a link to the ebay lithium batteries i bought.. they are a direct replacement for a 120 ah lead acid battery.. normal lead acid chargers will charge them fine..

expensive up front but they should last for many years..

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/100Ah-12V-LITHIUM-LiFePO4-Battery-for-Leisure-Solar-Wind-and-Off-grid-12-volt/131402654613?ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT&_trksid=p2057872.m2749.l2649

trog


Still WAY above my budget! My current lead-acid battery is 4 years old and still fine. If I look after it I should still have it for at least another 2 years, possibly longer. I could buy at least 3 more L/A leisure batteries for that price, and if each of them lasted me 5 years that would probably see out my caravanning days. My caravan probably won't last that long as it's already 29 years old, and neither might I. If I were only 29 years old I might think differently, but at my age, no way!


-------------
Best Regards,
Colin


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via mobile 20/1/2021 at 8:10pm
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Lithium is the way forward at some point when the price gets more reasonable, but currently at close to £500 for a generic unbranded Chinese battery with a only a (probably worthless?) one year guarantee, not for me or my budget yet.

Good luck to the early adopters though, I will wait and watch developments with interest

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